Re: Experimental C Build System

From	Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com>
Newsgroups	comp.lang.c, comp.unix.programmer
Subject	Re: Experimental C Build System
Date	2024-02-01 22:23 +0200
Organization	A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID	<20240201222328.00006859@yahoo.com> (permalink)
References	(8 earlier) <upeab3$1m2f4$1@dont-email.me> <upflbj$202rb$1@dont-email.me> <upfve3$21uv7$1@dont-email.me> <upgcbm$246u1$1@dont-email.me> <upgo72$26abt$1@dont-email.me>

Cross-posted to 2 groups.

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On Thu, 1 Feb 2024 18:34:08 +0000
bart <bc@freeuk.com> wrote:

> On 01/02/2024 15:11, David Brown wrote:
> 
> >>> 1. It lets you split the program into separate parts - generally 
> >>> separate files.  This is essential for scalability for large
> >>> programs.
> >>>
> >>> 2. You can compile modules independently to allow partial builds.
> >>>
> >>> 3. Modules generally have some way to specify exported symbols
> >>> and facilities that can be used by other modules.
> >>>
> >>> 4. Modules can "import" other modules, gaining access to those 
> >>> modules' exported symbols.
> >>>
> >>> 5. Modules provide encapsulation of data, code and namespaces.
> >>>
> >>> 6. Modules can be used in a hierarchical system, building big
> >>> modules from smaller ones to support larger libraries with many
> >>> files.
> >>>
> >>> 7. Modules provide a higher level concept that can be used by 
> >>> language tools to see how the whole program fits together or
> >>> interact with package managers and librarian tools.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> C provides 1, 2, 3, and 4 if you use a "file.c/file.h"
> >>> organisation. It provides a limited form of 5 (everything that is
> >>> not exported is "static"), but scaling to larger systems is
> >>> dependent on identifier prefixes.
> >>>
> >>> You seem to be thinking purely about item 7 above.  This is, I
> >>> think, common in interpreted languages (where modules have to be
> >>> found at run-time, where the user is there but the developer is
> >>> not).   
> >> I've been implementing languages with language-supported modules
> >> for about 12 years.
> >>
> >> They generally provide 1, 2, 4, 5, and 7 from your list, and
> >> partial support of 6.  
> > 
> > Sure.  Programming languages need that if they are to scale at all.
> >   
> >>
> >> They don't provide 2 (compiling individual modules) because the
> >> aim is a very fast, whole-program compler.  
> > 
> > Okay.
> > 
> > 
> > But what you are talking about to add to C is item 7, nothing more.
> > That is not adding "modules" to C.  Your suggestion might be useful
> > to some people for some projects, but that doesn't make it
> > "modules" in any real sense.  
> 
> Item 7 is my biggest stumbling to building open source C projects.
> 
> While the developer (say you), knows the necessary info, and can
> somehow import into the build system, my job is trying to get it out.
> 
> I can't use the intended build system because for one reason or
> another it doesn't work, or requires complex dependencies (MSYS,
> CMake, MSTOOLS, .configure), or I want to run mcc on it.
> 
> That info could trivially be added to the C source code. Nobody
> actually needs to use my #pragma scheme; it could simply be a block
> comment on one of the modules.
> 
> I'm sure with all your complicated tools, they could surely dump some 
> text that looks like:
> 
>     // List of source files to build the binary cipher.c:
>     // cipher.c
>     // hmac.c
>     // sha2.c
> 
> and prepend it to one of the files.  Even a README will do.
> 
> That wouldn't hurt would it?
> 
> >> Given a module scheme, the tool needed to build a whole program
> >> should not need to be told about the names and location of every
> >> constituent module; it should be able to determine that from
> >> what's already in the source code, given only a start point.  
> > 
> > Why?
> > 
> > You can't just take some idea that you like, and that is suitable
> > for the projects you use, and assume it applies to everyone else.
> > 
> > I have no problem telling my build system, or compilers, where the
> > files are.  In fact, I'd have a lot of problems if I couldn't do
> > that.  It is not normal development practice to have the source
> > files in the same directory that you use for building the object
> > code and binaries. 
> >>
> >> Even with independent compilation, you might be able to use that
> >> info to determine dependencies, but you will need that module
> >> hierarchy if you want to compile individual modules.  
> > 
> > I already have tools for determining dependencies.  What can your 
> > methods do that mine can't?
> > 
> > (And don't bother saying that you can do it without extra tools - 
> > everyone who wants "make" and "gcc" has them on hand.  And those
> > who want an IDE that figures out dependencies for them have a dozen
> > free options there too.  These are all standard tools available to
> > everyone.)  
> 
> So, if C were to acquire modules, so that a C compiler could
> determine that all for it itself (maybe even work out for itself
> which need recompiling), would you just ignore that feature and use
> the same auxiliary methods you have always done?
> 
> You don't see that the language taking over task (1) of the things
> that makefiles do, and possibly (2) (of the list I posted; repeated
> below), can streamline makefiles to make them shorter, simpler,
> easier to write and to read, and with fewer opportunities to get
> stuff wrong?
> 
> That was a rhetorical question. Obviously not.
> 
> 
> > Perhaps I would find your tools worked for a "Hello, world"
> > project. Maybe they were still okay as it got slightly bigger.
> > Then I'd have something that they could not handle, and I'd reach
> > for make.  What would be the point of using "make" to automate -
> > for example - post-processing of a binary to add a CRC check, but
> > using your tools to handle the build?  It's much easier just to use
> > "make" for the whole thing.  
> 
> 
> Because building one binary is a process should be the job of a 
> compiler, not some random external tool that knows nothing of the 
> language or compiler.
> 
> Maybe you think makefiles should individually list all the 1000s of 
> functions of a project too?
> 
> > You are offering me a fish.  I am offering to teach you to fish, 
> > including where to go to catch different kinds of fish.  This is
> > really a no-brainer choice.  
> 
> That analogy makes no sense.
> 
> Let me try and explain what I do: I write whole-program compilers.
> That means that, each time you do a new build, it will reprocess each
> file from source. They use the language's module scheme to know which
> files to process.
> 
> I tend to build C programs by recompiling all modules too. So I want
> to introduce the same convenience I have elsewhere.
> 
> It works for me, and I'm sure could work for others if they didn't
> have makefiles forced down their throats and hardwired into their
> brains.
> 
> ----------------------------
> (Repost)
> 
> I've already covered this in many posts on the subject. But 'make'
> deals with three kinds of requirements:
> 
> (1) Specifying what the modules are to be compiled and combined into
> one binary file
> 
> (2) Specifying dependences between all files to allow rebuilding of
> that one file with minimal recompilation
> 
> (3) Everything else needed in a complex project: running processes to
>      generate files file config.h, creating multiple binaries,
> specifying dependencies between binaries, installation etc
> 
> My proposal tackles only (1), which is something that many languages
> now have the means to deal with themselves. I already stated that (2)
> is not covered.
> 
> But you may still need makefiles to deal with (3).
> 
> If your main requirement /is/ only (1), then my idea is to move the 
> necessary info into the source code, and tackle it with the C
> compiler.
> 


You proposal and needs of David Brown are not necessarily
contradictory. 
All you need to do to satisfy him is to add to your compiler an option
for export of dependencies in make-compatible format, i.e. something
very similar to -MD option of gcc.

Then David could write in his makefile:

out/foo.elf : main_foo.c
  mcc -MD $< -o $@

-include out/foo.d

And then to proceed with automatiion of his pre and post-processing needs.

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Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-01-29 16:03 +0000
  Re: Experimental C Build System Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-01-30 00:57 +0000
    Re: Experimental C Build System "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-01-29 17:38 -0800
      Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-01-30 09:06 +0100
        Re: Experimental C Build System "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-01-30 15:23 -0800
          Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-01-31 08:36 +0100
            Re: Experimental C Build System "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-01-31 19:12 -0800
        Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-01-31 00:44 +0000
    Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-01-30 01:45 +0000
      Re: Experimental C Build System Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-01-30 04:46 +0000
        Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-01-30 11:52 +0000
          Re: Experimental C Build System Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-01-30 16:50 +0000
            Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-01-30 17:57 +0000
            Re: Experimental C Build System Richard Harnden <richard.nospam@gmail.invalid> - 2024-01-30 19:22 +0000
              Re: Experimental C Build System vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> - 2024-01-31 16:41 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> - 2024-01-31 19:01 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-01-31 20:25 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-02-01 09:39 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-01 11:31 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-02-01 16:11 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-02-01 17:33 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-01 18:34 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-02-01 22:23 +0200
                Re: Experimental C Build System scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-02-01 20:55 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-02-01 13:10 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-02-01 22:38 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-02-02 00:55 +0200
                Re: Experimental C Build System Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-02-01 23:31 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-02-02 02:08 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-02-02 09:02 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-02-02 15:28 +0200
                Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-02-02 15:49 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-02-02 16:53 +0200
                Stu Feldman (Was: Experimental C Build System) gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2024-02-02 16:29 +0000
                Re: Stu Feldman (Was: Experimental C Build System) Kaz Kylheku <433-929-6894@kylheku.com> - 2024-02-02 17:29 +0000
                Re: Stu Feldman (Was: Experimental C Build System) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2024-02-04 05:44 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-02 13:47 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-02-02 15:57 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-02-02 15:18 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-02 17:44 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-02-02 18:26 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-02-03 05:45 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-02-03 21:24 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2024-02-03 13:19 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-02-02 21:42 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-02 22:12 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-02-03 01:29 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-03 12:02 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-02-03 12:25 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-02-04 06:47 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-02-04 19:52 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-02-04 19:58 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-02-03 05:52 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-02-03 14:52 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-03 14:59 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-02-04 06:51 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-04 11:08 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-02-03 15:44 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-03 16:03 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-02-03 17:02 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-02-04 13:29 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-02-03 12:31 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-03 22:11 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-02-03 16:24 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-04 01:19 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-02-03 17:51 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System "Gary R. Schmidt" <grschmidt@acm.org> - 2024-02-04 14:07 +1100
                Re: Experimental C Build System "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-02-04 20:01 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-02-04 04:56 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-02-03 21:36 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-02-03 21:41 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-02-04 13:44 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-02-04 15:50 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-02-04 18:27 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-02-04 14:52 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System Kees Nuyt <k.nuyt@nospam.demon.nl> - 2024-02-05 17:57 +0100
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                Re: Experimental C Build System scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-02-05 19:11 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-02-03 12:29 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-02-04 06:43 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-02-04 14:51 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-02-03 21:15 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-02-03 21:39 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2024-02-03 14:23 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-02-03 13:48 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-03 14:16 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Kaz Kylheku <433-929-6894@kylheku.com> - 2024-02-03 18:17 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-03 20:12 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Jim Jackson <jj@franjam.org.uk> - 2024-02-04 16:13 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-02-04 14:08 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System Kaz Kylheku <433-929-6894@kylheku.com> - 2024-02-04 18:22 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-02-04 13:53 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-04 14:01 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-02-04 18:36 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-02-04 22:46 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-04 23:29 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-02-04 15:32 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System Jim Jackson <jj@franjam.org.uk> - 2024-02-05 17:37 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-02-05 18:03 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-05 18:42 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-02-05 13:25 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-05 21:31 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-02-05 13:40 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System Kaz Kylheku <433-929-6894@kylheku.com> - 2024-02-05 22:29 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-02-05 14:39 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System Kaz Kylheku <433-929-6894@kylheku.com> - 2024-02-05 22:47 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-06 00:03 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-02-05 19:16 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-02-05 00:07 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-02-04 16:10 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System candycanearter07 <no@thanks.net> - 2024-02-05 10:41 -0600
                Re: Experimental C Build System Kaz Kylheku <433-929-6894@kylheku.com> - 2024-02-05 18:13 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System candycanearter07 <no@thanks.net> - 2024-02-06 23:41 -0600
                Re: Experimental C Build System Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-02-07 09:56 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2024-02-07 11:10 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Dan Purgert <dan@djph.net> - 2024-02-07 11:13 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System "Gary R. Schmidt" <grschmidt@acm.org> - 2024-02-07 23:46 +1100
                Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-02-07 15:09 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-07 14:21 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System candycanearter07 <no@thanks.net> - 2024-02-07 10:11 -0600
                Re: Experimental C Build System Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-02-07 14:54 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2024-02-07 16:15 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2024-02-07 17:34 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-02-07 15:31 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Kaz Kylheku <433-929-6894@kylheku.com> - 2024-02-07 19:24 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-02-07 15:30 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System candycanearter07 <no@thanks.net> - 2024-02-07 10:12 -0600
                Re: Experimental C Build System Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-02-07 08:40 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System candycanearter07 <no@thanks.net> - 2024-02-07 12:24 -0600
                Re: Experimental C Build System Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-02-05 01:45 +0000
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                Re: Experimental C Build System Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-02-04 20:41 -0800
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                Re: Experimental C Build System Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2024-02-05 06:48 -0800
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                Re: Experimental C Build System "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-02-04 22:46 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-02-05 15:57 -0800
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                Re: Experimental C Build System Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-02-05 23:18 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Kaz Kylheku <433-929-6894@kylheku.com> - 2024-02-06 00:16 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-02-06 14:32 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-02-06 14:40 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Kaz Kylheku <433-929-6894@kylheku.com> - 2024-02-06 16:59 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-02-06 19:20 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-02-06 20:32 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-02-06 20:34 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Lew Pitcher <lew.pitcher@digitalfreehold.ca> - 2024-02-06 20:49 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-02-06 13:07 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-02-06 21:39 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Lew Pitcher <lew.pitcher@digitalfreehold.ca> - 2024-02-07 15:02 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Kaz Kylheku <433-929-6894@kylheku.com> - 2024-02-06 21:09 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-02-06 21:43 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2024-02-07 00:51 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System Kaz Kylheku <433-929-6894@kylheku.com> - 2024-02-07 02:18 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2024-02-07 04:21 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System Richard Harnden <richard.nospam@gmail.invalid> - 2024-02-07 07:17 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2024-02-07 12:59 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System "Gary R. Schmidt" <grschmidt@acm.org> - 2024-02-07 23:53 +1100
                Re: Experimental C Build System Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-02-07 15:45 +0200
                Re: Experimental C Build System Kaz Kylheku <433-929-6894@kylheku.com> - 2024-02-06 00:07 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-02-06 10:08 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-02-01 22:34 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-01 22:29 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-02-01 15:28 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-02-02 01:03 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-02-01 17:42 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-02-02 02:43 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-02-01 19:03 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-02-02 10:54 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-02-02 21:16 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-02-02 16:09 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-02-03 01:32 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Kaz Kylheku <433-929-6894@kylheku.com> - 2024-02-03 02:36 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2024-02-03 00:53 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-02-03 13:51 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-02-03 17:56 -0500
                Re: Experimental C Build System Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2024-02-04 07:52 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2024-02-04 06:18 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System tTh <tth@none.invalid> - 2024-02-02 03:22 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-02 11:13 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System "Gary R. Schmidt" <grschmidt@acm.org> - 2024-02-03 00:25 +1100
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-02 13:29 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-02-02 10:47 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-02-02 15:45 +0200
                Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-02-02 16:26 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2024-02-03 14:39 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-02-03 16:26 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2024-02-03 17:11 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-02-06 13:59 +0200
                Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-02-06 13:14 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-02-06 14:32 +0200
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-06 14:16 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-02-06 17:02 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-02-06 20:31 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-02 14:14 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-02-02 16:43 +0200
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-02 15:18 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System tTh <tth@none.invalid> - 2024-02-02 20:43 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-02 20:16 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-02-02 16:31 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-02 17:00 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Kaz Kylheku <433-929-6894@kylheku.com> - 2024-02-02 17:31 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-02-02 10:36 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-02 19:52 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-02-02 20:21 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Kaz Kylheku <433-929-6894@kylheku.com> - 2024-02-02 21:09 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-02-02 13:15 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2024-02-03 15:13 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-02-02 21:23 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-02 21:51 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-02-03 01:31 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-03 12:16 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Kaz Kylheku <433-929-6894@kylheku.com> - 2024-02-03 17:59 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-03 19:35 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System tTh <tth@none.invalid> - 2024-02-03 21:57 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-02-04 18:48 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-04 20:18 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-02-04 20:55 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> - 2024-02-07 02:57 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-02-07 03:18 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-02-07 15:27 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-02-07 15:48 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-02-07 16:30 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-02-07 09:42 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-07 10:40 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-02-07 15:37 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-02-04 22:51 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-04 23:11 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-02-05 13:42 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2024-02-05 14:59 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-05 15:45 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-02-05 11:25 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-02-05 22:46 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-02-05 14:43 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-02-04 22:42 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-02-04 14:53 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-02-04 14:02 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System candycanearter07 <no@thanks.net> - 2024-02-05 10:48 -0600
                Re: Experimental C Build System Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-02-05 17:29 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System candycanearter07 <no@thanks.net> - 2024-02-05 11:36 -0600
                Re: Experimental C Build System Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-02-03 14:04 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System Kaz Kylheku <433-929-6894@kylheku.com> - 2024-02-02 18:54 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-02-03 06:04 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-02-02 22:13 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-02-03 06:43 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-02-03 00:02 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-02-03 08:47 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Kaz Kylheku <433-929-6894@kylheku.com> - 2024-02-03 06:30 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-02-03 11:17 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-02-03 14:02 -0800
                [meta] Re: Experimental C Build System Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2024-02-03 15:04 +0100
                Re: [meta] Re: Experimental C Build System Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2024-02-03 07:19 -0800
                Re: [meta] Re: Experimental C Build System Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2024-02-04 05:29 +0100
                Re: [meta] Re: Experimental C Build System Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-02-04 05:37 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Kaz Kylheku <433-929-6894@kylheku.com> - 2024-02-02 16:26 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-02-01 23:30 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-02-02 11:05 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-02-02 21:18 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-04 15:50 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-02-02 00:26 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-02 00:35 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-02-02 11:13 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-02 10:54 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-02-02 14:15 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2024-02-02 01:46 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System Kaz Kylheku <433-929-6894@kylheku.com> - 2024-02-01 16:20 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-02-01 21:34 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Richard Harnden <richard.nospam@gmail.invalid> - 2024-02-01 16:09 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-01 17:32 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-02-01 19:25 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-01 19:51 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-02-01 12:12 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-02-01 12:43 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-02-01 22:36 +0200
                Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-02-01 23:09 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-02-01 23:32 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-01-31 21:17 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-02-01 09:48 +0100
                Re: Experimental C Build System Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-02-01 11:49 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-02-01 21:39 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-02-01 15:24 -0800
                Re: Experimental C Build System Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-02-01 23:38 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Kaz Kylheku <433-929-6894@kylheku.com> - 2024-02-01 23:53 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-02-01 23:14 +0100
      Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-01-30 09:17 +0100
        Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-01-30 12:09 +0000
        Re: Experimental C Build System "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-01-30 15:25 -0800
          Re: Experimental C Build System "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-01-30 17:50 -0800
        Re: Experimental C Build System Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-01-31 03:14 +0000
          Re: Experimental C Build System "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-01-31 20:38 -0800
        Re: Experimental C Build System Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-02-05 13:46 +0000
        Re: Experimental C Build System Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-02-05 14:06 +0000
          Re: Experimental C Build System scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-02-05 14:48 +0000
            Re: Experimental C Build System Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-02-05 15:23 +0000
  Re: Experimental C Build System Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2024-01-30 16:46 -0800
    Re: Experimental C Build System Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-01-31 03:13 +0000
      Re: Experimental C Build System Kaz Kylheku <433-929-6894@kylheku.com> - 2024-01-31 03:23 +0000
        Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-01-31 08:47 +0100
          Re: Experimental C Build System Spiros Bousbouras <spibou@gmail.com> - 2024-01-31 11:02 +0000
            Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-01-31 15:31 +0100
              Re: Experimental C Build System scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-01-31 15:13 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-01-31 23:00 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-02-01 00:29 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-02-01 03:07 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-02-01 15:00 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-02-01 23:40 +0000
                system(3) (was: Re: Experimental C Build System) vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> - 2024-02-01 08:15 +0000
              Re: Experimental C Build System Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-01-31 23:02 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-02-01 00:33 +0000
                Re: Experimental C Build System Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2024-02-01 15:11 +0100
              Re: Experimental C Build System Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2024-02-01 14:55 +0100
            Re: Experimental C Build System Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2024-02-01 14:42 +0100
      Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-01-31 12:19 +0000
    Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-01 14:29 +0000
      Re: Experimental C Build System David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-02-01 16:43 +0100
      Re: Experimental C Build System Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2024-02-03 01:05 -0800
        Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-03 11:54 +0000
          Re: Experimental C Build System Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2024-02-03 07:17 -0800
            Re: Experimental C Build System Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-02-03 15:54 +0000
            Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-03 16:05 +0000
          Re: Experimental C Build System "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-02-03 12:39 -0800
            Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-02-03 22:19 +0000
              Re: Experimental C Build System "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-02-04 20:56 -0800
              Re: Experimental C Build System "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-02-04 20:57 -0800
  Re: Experimental C Build System bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-01-31 20:36 +0000

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