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Groups > alt.folklore.computers > #154407 > unrolled thread
| Started by | Mike Hore <mike_horeREM@OVE.invalid.aapt.net.au> |
|---|---|
| First post | 2015-11-12 14:31 +0930 |
| Last post | 2016-02-22 16:21 -0800 |
| Articles | 7 on this page of 107 — 30 participants |
Back to article view | Back to alt.folklore.computers
IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Mike Hore <mike_horeREM@OVE.invalid.aapt.net.au> - 2015-11-12 14:31 +0930
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) mentificium@gmail.com - 2015-11-12 04:49 -0800
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2015-11-12 18:51 -0800
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Anne & Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2015-11-12 20:06 -0800
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Mike Hore <mike_horeREM@OVE.invalid.aapt.net.au> - 2015-11-13 14:45 +0930
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Mike Hore <mike_horeREM@OVE.invalid.aapt.net.au> - 2015-11-13 14:51 +0930
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Anne & Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2015-11-12 22:44 -0800
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Mike Hore <mike_horeREM@OVE.invalid.aapt.net.au> - 2015-11-14 10:28 +0930
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Anne & Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2015-11-13 17:20 -0800
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2015-11-14 17:13 -0500
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) hancock4@bbs.cpcn.com - 2015-11-14 14:43 -0800
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2015-11-15 07:18 -0500
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Anne & Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2015-11-15 09:07 -0800
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) hancock4@bbs.cpcn.com - 2015-11-15 13:09 -0800
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Anne & Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2015-11-15 13:35 -0800
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) hancock4@bbs.cpcn.com - 2015-11-15 16:03 -0800
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) JimP <solosam90@gmail.com> - 2015-11-15 18:26 -0600
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) hancock4@bbs.cpcn.com - 2015-11-15 16:13 -0800
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) "John Jackson" <jj@nospam.com> - 2015-11-16 13:27 +1100
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Jon Elson <jmelson@wustl.edu> - 2015-12-02 17:20 -0600
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Rich Alderson <news@alderson.users.panix.com> - 2015-12-03 20:39 -0500
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Dan Espen <despen@verizon.net> - 2015-11-16 01:16 -0500
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2015-11-16 08:22 -0500
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Jon Elson <jmelson@wustl.edu> - 2015-12-02 17:16 -0600
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Anne & Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2015-12-02 19:14 -0800
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2015-11-13 17:45 -0800
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Dan Espen <despen@verizon.net> - 2015-11-13 21:02 -0500
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2015-11-13 17:54 -0800
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2015-11-13 18:00 -0800
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Mike Hore <mike_horeREM@OVE.invalid.aapt.net.au> - 2015-11-14 12:22 +0930
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Mike Hore <mike_horeREM@OVE.invalid.aapt.net.au> - 2015-11-16 08:12 +0930
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) hancock4@bbs.cpcn.com - 2015-11-16 12:52 -0800
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Mike Hore <mike_horeREM@OVE.invalid.aapt.net.au> - 2015-11-17 08:21 +0930
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) hancock4@bbs.cpcn.com - 2015-11-16 16:39 -0800
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Mike Hore <mike_horeREM@OVE.invalid.aapt.net.au> - 2015-11-17 10:22 +0930
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2015-11-16 17:52 -0800
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Mike Hore <mike_horeREM@OVE.invalid.aapt.net.au> - 2015-11-17 16:14 +0930
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2015-11-17 06:22 -0800
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2015-11-17 11:30 -0500
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Greymaus <mausg@mail.com> - 2015-11-17 16:43 +0000
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Mike Hore <mike_horeREM@OVE.invalid.aapt.net.au> - 2015-11-18 08:29 +0930
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) "Charles Richmond" <numerist@aquaporin4.com> - 2015-11-17 17:38 -0600
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2015-11-17 17:36 -0800
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Mike Hore <mike_horeREM@OVE.invalid.aapt.net.au> - 2015-11-18 12:23 +0930
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> - 2015-11-18 13:46 +0000
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Greymaus <mausg@mail.com> - 2015-11-18 15:16 +0000
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2015-11-18 07:31 -0800
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Greymaus <mausg@mail.com> - 2015-11-18 15:52 +0000
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) hancock4@bbs.cpcn.com - 2015-11-18 10:02 -0800
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2015-11-18 18:25 +0000
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Dan Espen <despen@verizon.net> - 2015-11-18 13:37 -0500
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) hancock4@bbs.cpcn.com - 2015-11-18 11:06 -0800
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Greymaus <mausg@mail.com> - 2015-11-18 19:21 +0000
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) "hunar" <hunar@nospam.com> - 2015-11-19 16:09 +1100
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2015-11-18 16:09 -0500
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) "Charles Richmond" <numerist@aquaporin4.com> - 2015-11-19 14:56 -0600
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Greymaus <mausg@mail.com> - 2015-11-20 09:53 +0000
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Greymaus <mausg@mail.com> - 2015-11-18 19:12 +0000
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2015-11-19 16:24 +0000
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Joe Pfeiffer <pfeiffer@cs.nmsu.edu> - 2015-11-18 15:24 -0700
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> - 2015-11-19 14:26 +0000
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2015-11-18 16:09 -0500
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) "hunar" <hunar@nospam.com> - 2015-11-19 16:11 +1100
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Alfred Falk <falk@arc.ab.ca> - 2015-11-18 21:25 +0000
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) "hunar" <hunar@nospam.com> - 2015-11-19 16:18 +1100
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Alfred Falk <falk@arc.ab.ca> - 2015-11-20 19:04 +0000
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) "hunar" <hunar@nospam.com> - 2015-11-21 11:29 +1100
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2015-11-19 16:01 +1100
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) maus <mausg@mail.com> - 2015-11-18 10:10 +0000
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Mike Hore <mike_horeREM@OVE.invalid.aapt.net.au> - 2015-11-19 10:06 +0930
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2015-11-19 15:32 +0000
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) "hunar" <hunar@nospam.com> - 2015-11-20 05:58 +1100
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2015-11-19 19:15 +0000
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Bob Eager <news0005@eager.cx> - 2015-11-19 20:50 +0000
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Stan Barr <plan.b@bluesomatic.org> - 2015-11-20 07:59 +0000
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2015-11-20 07:07 -0500
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2015-11-20 14:24 +0000
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Andrew Swallow <am.swallow@btinternet.com> - 2015-11-20 17:58 +0000
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> - 2015-11-20 13:33 +0000
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Dave Garland <dave.garland@wizinfo.com> - 2015-11-19 11:23 -0600
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Greymaus <mausg@mail.com> - 2015-11-19 18:36 +0000
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2015-11-20 04:52 -0800
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2015-11-20 23:27 +0000
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Anne & Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2015-11-20 16:34 -0800
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Andrew Swallow <am.swallow@btinternet.com> - 2015-11-21 12:47 +0000
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) "hunar" <hunar@nospam.com> - 2015-11-22 06:30 +1100
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Andrew Swallow <am.swallow@btinternet.com> - 2015-11-22 01:53 +0000
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Anne & Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2015-11-21 18:33 -0800
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) "hunar" <hunar@nospam.com> - 2015-11-22 15:11 +1100
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Dave Garland <dave.garland@wizinfo.com> - 2015-11-21 23:59 -0600
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) "hunar" <hunar@nospam.com> - 2015-11-22 20:10 +1100
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) "Osmium" <r124c4u102@comcast.net> - 2015-11-22 06:30 -0600
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) "hunar" <hunar@nospam.com> - 2015-11-23 05:44 +1100
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) "gareth" <no.spam@thank.you.invalid> - 2015-11-21 16:45 +0000
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2015-11-19 14:34 -0500
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Joy Beeson <jbeeson@invalid.net.invalid> - 2015-11-19 21:40 -0400
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) "hunar" <hunar@nospam.com> - 2015-11-20 15:14 +1100
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Joy Beeson <jbeeson@invalid.net.invalid> - 2015-11-20 19:27 -0400
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2015-11-20 06:09 +0000
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) "hunar" <hunar@nospam.com> - 2015-11-19 16:29 +1100
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) "Osmium" <r124c4u102@comcast.net> - 2015-11-19 07:25 -0600
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2015-11-19 06:56 -0800
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) "hunar" <hunar@nospam.com> - 2015-11-20 05:50 +1100
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) "hunar" <hunar@nospam.com> - 2015-11-19 16:36 +1100
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) hancock4@bbs.cpcn.com - 2015-11-16 18:29 -0800
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) Mike Hore <mike_horeREM@OVE.invalid.aapt.net.au> - 2016-02-07 13:25 +0930
Re: IMPI (System/38 / AS/400 historical) jfehlinger@comcast.net - 2016-02-22 16:21 -0800
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| From | "Osmium" <r124c4u102@comcast.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-11-19 07:25 -0600 |
| Message-ID | <db60v4FevurU1@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #154646 |
"hunar" wrote: > Lots of footage of that stuff in the series Outback Truckers. I don't think _Outback Truckers_ has been shown on US cable. There used to be a good Australian science/ technology show that has been gone for several years, I can't recall the name of it. That was the only Australian TV shown on the mainstream cable channels that comes to mind.
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| From | Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-11-19 06:56 -0800 |
| Message-ID | <71029568-ec5a-409b-af7c-7f06318e097d@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #154650 |
On Thursday, November 19, 2015 at 6:25:58 AM UTC-7, Osmium wrote: > I don't think _Outback Truckers_ has been shown on US cable. What? There are enough reality TV shows to fill all those channels out there? And here I thought it was directly intended to give Ice Road Truckers some competition. John Savard
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| From | "hunar" <hunar@nospam.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-11-20 05:50 +1100 |
| Message-ID | <db6jvmFjuuqU1@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #154650 |
"Osmium" <r124c4u102@comcast.net> wrote in message news:db60v4FevurU1@mid.individual.net... > "hunar" wrote: > >> Lots of footage of that stuff in the series Outback Truckers. > > I don't think _Outback Truckers_ has been shown on US cable. It is available on Pirate Bay and Kickass torrents, https://kat.cr/ > There used to be a good Australian science/ technology show that has been > gone for several years, I can't recall the name of it. Likely Quantum, now called Catalyst. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catalyst_(TV_program) > That was the only Australian TV shown on the mainstream cable channels > that comes to mind.
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| From | "hunar" <hunar@nospam.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-11-19 16:36 +1100 |
| Message-ID | <db55e8F88afU1@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #154614 |
"Quadibloc" <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> wrote in message news:46ec4e6f-c036-4676-aadb-4b4eeba6f952@googlegroups.com... > On Tuesday, November 17, 2015 at 3:59:49 PM UTC-7, Mike Hore wrote: >> It's 5 days to Sydney by >> road. > > So there _are_ roads going through the Northern Territory. > Does one have to take special precautions when travelling along them? Not with the major national highways. > Or are there towns and villages and gas stations along their length, much > like anywhere else? Yes, tho the distance between them can be very great. > (Special precautions being things like taking an emergency radio, > 14 days supply of food and water in case your car breaks down, Not with the major national highways, but yes with the less used roads. > cans of gasoline for stretches of road longer > than the capacity of one's fuel tank, and so on.) Not with the major national highways, but you do need to be careful to fill up when you can. > If anything even remotely resembling that were the case, such a car trip > would > not be for the unwary. But then, going from Sydney to Perth by road, even > if it > isn't through deadly impassable jungle, still goes through a lot of > Outback, so > one probably should bring extra water along for that kind of trip too. Its not essential on the major national highways, but is for the rest.
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| From | hancock4@bbs.cpcn.com |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-11-16 18:29 -0800 |
| Message-ID | <61cbbf51-c635-4699-9969-7e33f233c6cf@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #154577 |
On Monday, November 16, 2015 at 7:52:20 PM UTC-5, Mike Hore wrote: > > I don't know if they still allow visitors, but if practical, > > it is a fascinating place. > I'd love to, but it's a long swim from here (Darwin, Australia) But I heard Australians are great swimmers <g>. Actually, I always wanted to visit Australia. Seems like a neat place. I have the photo book, 'A Day in the Life of Australia", although that's some years old now.
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| From | Mike Hore <mike_horeREM@OVE.invalid.aapt.net.au> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-02-07 13:25 +0930 |
| Message-ID | <n96f2o$1fn$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #154568 |
I've been a long time away from this discussion, but I do have something
to report:
> On 17/11/2015 6:22 AM, hancock4@bbs.cpcn.com wrote:
>> On Sunday, November 15, 2015 at 5:42:54 PM UTC-5, Mike Hore wrote:
>>
>>> However the process looks very bureaucratic, even having to send a
>>> request by snail mail. It would be very easy for them to decide it's
>>> still confidential, especially as I'm just a private individual, not a
>>> university. And then from the terms and conditions I wouldn't have the
>>> right to send it to Bitsavers. It looks to me like it would be much
>>> better for somebody within IBM to do it.
>>
>> In fairness to IBM, it would not be easy for them decide if something
>> like this is still confidential. First, a lot of factors go into
>> whether something can be released or not. Secondly, the archives
>> can't decide that, it must inquire to technical people.
>>
>> Some years ago IBM was burned by malicious individuals utilizing
>> stuff in their archives. So, it would be understandable that
>> they'd be gun shy.
>
> OK thanks for that. Yes, that makes sense. Legal advice would probably
> be needed as well as technical, given that the document WAS confidential
> in the '80s when the technology under the Machine Interface was secret
> to preserve the integrity of the system and its technology independence.
> There was all sorts of antitrust stuff going on in the `80s which as
> you know is why everything under the MI was labelled "microcode". I'm
> sure that's all ancient history now, but somebody would need to decide that.
>
> I might try sending my request anyway, but I'm not too hopeful.
I got a very nice reply from IBM Archives to my request for SC21-9037,
just before Christmas. They said they had made a detailed search and
that document doesn't now exist anywhere that they have on record, which
would cover all IBM facilities. (I don't have their reply to hand at
the moment, but that was the gist.)
This makes sense, since it's pretty old now. So I guess the only
prospect for me getting my hands on it is if somebody has one in their
private posession, and decides to send it to Bitsavers because of its
historical importance.
Cheers, Mike.
---------------------------------------------------------------
Mike Hore mike_horeREM@OVE.invalid.aapt.net.au
---------------------------------------------------------------
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| From | jfehlinger@comcast.net |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-02-22 16:21 -0800 |
| Message-ID | <6fe3b43f-7c1a-4b8c-ad7c-deeb8c3809f2@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #154407 |
> On 14 Nov 2015 12:22:46 Mike Hore wrote: > > > On 14/11/2015 11:24 AM, Quadibloc wrote: > > I've found a reply to an old post by Eric Smith of Retrocomputing that > > gives some helpful leads: > > > > (begin quote) > > IBM published a manual describing the S/38 instruction set in detail. > > The CISC AS/400 instruction set is nearly identical. The manual was > > called "S/38 Internal Microprogramming Instructions, Formats and > > Functions Reference Manual", pub number SC21-9037. It's still listed > > on IBMlink. . . > > > > They say it's obsolete (pub date is 10/81!), but they list a price of > > $32.50. Don't know if they'll send you one. > > Now that's one that I'd love to get my hands on, but it doesn't appear > to be available any more. And Googling for "SC21-9037" doesn't give any > useful hits. > > However the Machine Interface (MI) manual went up on bitsavers > last year. . . > > . . .GA21-9331-1_System_38_Functional_Reference_Manual_Feb81.pdf > > That's the target for the compilers. It's great to have that manual > available at least. Those manuals (among others) were also mentioned in an AS400 thread a while a while (1996!) back: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/comp.sys.ibm.as400.misc/Sh-pOpWFfb8 ----------------- >> We need (badly) the following S/38 manuals: >> >> IBM System/38 CPF Data Areas, LY21-0570 >> IBM System/38 Logic Overviews and Component Descriptions, LY21-0571 >> CPF Logic Listings (microfiche) LJD4-300 >> IBM System/38 Functional Concepts Manual, GA21-9330 And why you're at it, pick up: IBM System/38 Functional Reference, GA21-9331 IBM System/38 Vertical Microcode Logic Overviews and Component Descriptions, SY21-0889 IBM System/38 Internal Microprogamming Instructions, Formats and Functions Reference Manual, SC21-9037 Does anybody have the microfiche? It was quite expensive at the time it was available (over 10 years ago). Something like $1500 to $1800. I wanted it but not that bad. Still if would be great to go over. Too bad these manuals are not available for that "open system", OS/400. Properly, all the "LY" manuals are "restricted" material. Only CPF license holders were allowed to purchase them. I think the OS/400 Diagnostic Aids manual is "LY" material. ==== Also, Mike Ross of "The Corestore" seems to have a System/38 in his collection: http://www.corestore.org/38.htm ----------------- "System came with a very full set of software, tapes, disks, and manuals - including the maintenance MAPs and MIMs." ====
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