Path: csiph.com!au2pb.net!usenet.blueworldhosting.com!feeder01.blueworldhosting.com!peer01.iad.highwinds-media.com!news.highwinds-media.com!feed-me.highwinds-media.com!Xl.tags.giganews.com!border1.nntp.dca1.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!local2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!news.giganews.com.POSTED!not-for-mail NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2015 00:07:34 -0500 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed; delsp=yes Newsgroups: alt.astronomy,alt.conspiracy,alt.usenet.kooks,sci.physics Subject: Re: The Top Lies and Deceptions of Loose Change References: Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2015 01:07:27 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: Quoted-Printable From: "\"Fakey's\" dogwhistle holder living at 5907 Stanton Ave., Pittsburgh, PA (aka Teh Mop Jockey), socked up as 5907 Stanton Avenue, Pittsburgh, PA 15206-2117" Organization: AUKTard Polizia Message-ID: User-Agent: Opera Mail/1.0 (Win32) Lines: 510 X-Usenet-Provider: http://www.giganews.com X-Trace: sv3-VG5/X7SFO67jdotvRwFqcZvAsC2NshpICo0GyNTdsfz1g4GLsmpDx6i9QP523kuChdxSoe12N1ZaVof!m6wR7Yr8YYnz9DGzC7FnWMpDvWs54jdOuK88X6PGrwigyu78XTLQGjrAOFZOmw== X-Complaints-To: abuse@giganews.com X-DMCA-Notifications: http://www.giganews.com/info/dmca.html X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly X-Postfilter: 1.3.40 X-Original-Bytes: 22729 X-Received-Bytes: 22843 X-Received-Body-CRC: 1098139002 Xref: csiph.com alt.astronomy:276177 alt.conspiracy:267716 alt.usenet.kooks:602427 sci.physics:521602 On Thu, 17 Sep 2015 00:31:11 -0400, Friendly Neighborhood Vote Wrangler = = Emeritus wrote: > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > 1. Claim: Charles Burlingame, an ex-Navy F4 pilot who worked in the > Pentagon, participated in an exercise simulating crashing a 757 into a= > building in October 2000, before retiring to take a job at American > Airlines. > > Truth: Charles Burlingame started working for AA in 1979 and retired > from the Naval Reserve in 1996, 4 years before these supposed > exercises took place. > Source: > --------------- > 2. Claim: Investors with prior knowledge of 9/11 made millions buying > put options on airline stock. > > Truth: Both the 9/11 committee and business journalists investigated > this claim and found nothing unusual. Much of the investment also > involved purchasing airline stock. > Source: > > --------------- > 3. Claim: Plane crashing into World Trade Center was identified as a > windowless cargo plane. > > Truth: The man who claimed this, Marc Birnbach, was over 2 miles away > at the time. > Source: > > --------------- > 4. Claim: An air traffic controller reported that they thought flight > 77 was a military plane. > > Truth: The full quote was referring to the unsafe way the plane was > flying, not that it was impossible for a civilian plane to fly like > that. "The speed, the maneuverability, the way that he turned, we all > thought in the radar room, all of us experienced air traffic > controllers, that that was a military plane you don't fly a 757 in > that manner. It's unsafe." > Source: > > --------------- > 5. Claim, Flight 77 managed to tear 5 light poles completely out of > the ground, without damaging either the wings or the light poles > themselves. > > Truth: We don=C3=A2=E2=82=AC=E2=84=A2t know that the wings were undama= ged, since they crashed > into the Pentagon fractions of a second later. There are pictures of > the light poles, however, which show them broken and twisted. > Source: > > --------------- > 6. Claim: The official explanation for flight 77 at the Pentagon is > that the intense heat from the jet fuel vaporized the entire plane. > > Truth: No official has made that claim, and in fact numerous pieces of= > the plane, including the bodies of the passengers, and the black boxes= > were found. > Source: > --------------- > 7. Claim: A spokesman for Rolls-Royce stated that engine parts found > at the Pentagon did not belong to any of their engines. > > Truth: The spokesman stated specifically that he was not an engineer > and was not familiar with the engine in question. > Source: > > --------------- > 8. Claim: Karl Schwarz President and Chief Executive Officer of Patmos= > Nanotechnologies LLC and I-Nets Security Systems, identified the > engine as being a JT8D turbojet engine belonging to an A-3 Skywarrior.= > > Karl Schwarz is a proven fraud and conspiracy theorist, with no known > background in technology or avionics. His companies are shell > corporations with no employees or products. Furthermore, the A-3 > Skywarrior never used a JT8D engine. The engine in question is > consistent with that of the Rolls-Royce RB211 used by the 757. > Source: > > Source: > --------------- > 9. Claim: Employees at the Pentagon were seen suspiciously carrying > away a large box shrouded in a blue tarp. > > Truth: The blue tarp was a tent, used to aid in the crash response. > Source: > > --------------- > 10. Claim: The damage to the Pentagon was completely inconsistent with= > a Boeing 757. > > Truth: Studies by NIST, the ASCE and Purdue University, including > computer simulations show that the damage was perfectly in keeping > with a crashing airplane. > Source: > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > 11. Claim: The only damage to the outer wall of the Pentagon was a > single hole, no more than 16 feet in diameter. > > Truth: The hole was approximately 90 feet wide. The 16 foot > measurement was only achieved by looking at pictures where the rest of= > the hole was obscured by smoke and foam from the firefighters. > Source: > > --------------- > 12. Claim: No wreckage was found on the Pentagon lawn. > > Truth: There are numerous pictures of plane wreckage, including those > with the American Airlines paint scheme. > Source: > --------------- > 13. Claim: A 16 foot hole was punched in the C ring of the Pentagon by= > the airplane=C3=A2=E2=82=AC=E2=84=A2s soft carbon fiber nose. > > Truth: It was a 12 foot hole, and it was made by the much more > resilient nose landing gear. > Source: > > --------------- > 14. Claim: A cruise missile hit the Pentagon > > Truth: Over a hundred documented witnesses, and many more unrecorded, > saw in broad daylight a large commercial jetliner crash into the > Pentagon. Many even specifically identified the airline. To this day, > not a single person has come forward claiming to have seen a cruise > missile. > Source: > > Source: > > --------------- > 15. Claim: A white marking on the lawn the week before indicated the > path of the crash. > > Truth: This section of the Pentagon was being renovated and cables > were being laid. And why would a cruise missile need directions > anyway? > Source: > --------------- > 16. Claim: A number of military personnel at the Pentagon specifically= > mentioned smelling cordite. > > Truth: The person (not a number of military personnel) in question was= > a lawyer not a munitions expert, and cordite is used in ammunition, > not explosives. > Source: > --------------- > 17. Claim: WTC 7, a 47 story office building 300 feet away from the > North Tower, suddenly collapsed for no reason. > > Truth: There was nothing sudden about it. The building was hit by > falling debris from one of the towers, was missing much of one corner,= > had a huge hole in the middle and was on fire for hours. The building > had started leaning and making creaking noises so fire department > officials ordered the evacuation of the area over an hour earlier. > Source: > Source: > --------------- > 18. Claim: On July 28th, 1945, a B-52 bomber lost in the fog crashed > into the 79th floor of the Empire State Building, 14 people dead, 1 > million dollars in damage. But, the building stands intact to this > day. > > Truth: It was a B-25 bomber (the B-52 was not produced until 9 years > later), a propeller driven plane about 1/10th the size of a 767, and > was traveling about 1/4th the speed. The fire only covered part of one= > floor, and was extinguished in less than an hour. > Source: > > --------------- > 19. Claim: On February 23rd, 1991, a 38 story skyscraper in > Philadelphia burned for more than 19 hours and spread over 8 floors. > It did not collapse. > > Truth: The firefighters fought the fire for 11 hours before they > evacuated the building fearing a collapse. The building, which was > never hit by an aircraft, was structurally unsound and later had to be= > demolished. > Source: > --------------- > 20. Claim: The south tower collapsed in just 9.2 seconds. > > Truth: It is difficult to time because of all the smoke and debris, > but it took significantly longer. > Source: > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > 21. Claim: 200,000 tons of steel shattered into sections no longer > than a couple feet long. > > Truth: Sections of the World Trade Center, often hundreds of feet long= > survived. > Source: > > --------------- > 22. Claim: Kevin Ryan from Underwriters Laboratories, the company that= > certified the steel that was used in the World Trade Center, stated > the steel should not have melted at the temperatures they were exposed= > to. > > Truth: Kevin Ryan worked in the water testing department, nobody > claimed the steel melted, and UL did not certify it in the first place= > (OK, that is technically 3 lies). > Source: > > --------------- > 23. Claim: Numerous firefighters and other witnesses heard explosions > in the world trade center indicating the use of demolitions. > > Truth: A jet liner with 10,000 gallons of jet fuel crashed into each > of the towers at 500 mph. It would be suspicious if they didn=C3=A2=E2= =82=AC=E2=84=A2t hear > subsequent explosions. > Source: > > NOTE: Some of those "explosions" were the viscoelastic dampers melting= > in the fire. They held the floor spars and truss frame together. The > floor spars provided horizontal support to the truss frame, the truss > frame provided vertical support to the floor spars. The interface > between these two structural components was pre-loaded to offset the > effect of the building's weight causing the truss frame to bow. When > the viscoelastic dampers went, they released a lot of potential > energy. Some of the "explosions" heard were the elevators dropping > into the basement. Their cables had been cut and weakened by the crash= > and ensuing fire. Still more of the explosions were the jet fuel > dumped down the elevator shafts, which ignited when the broken > elevator car electrical cables sparked and ignited the jet fuel fumes.= > --------------- > 24. Claim: Ben Fountain, a financial analyst who worked in the World > Trade Center, told People Magazine that in the weeks before 9-11, > there were a number of unannounced and unusual drills where sections > of both the Twin Towers and building 7 were evacuated for 'security > reasons'. > > Truth: Mr. Fountain only stated that his tower was evacuated. He > didn=C3=A2=E2=82=AC=E2=84=A2t say it in the context that the film pres= ents, that this somehow > gave them the opportunity to plant explosives, but to say that there > were previous threats against the towers. Other sources used by the > conspiracy movement contradict this. > Source: > > Source: > > --------------- > 25. Claim: Bomb sniffing dogs were removed from the World Trade Center= > only days before the attack. > > Truth: Security was actually increased for a couple of weeks; this > =C3=A2=E2=82=AC=C5=93removal=C3=A2=E2=82=AC=C2=9D was just security re= turning to normal. > Source: > > --------------- > 26. Claim: Seismic records prove that explosives were used in the > World Trade Center > > Truth: The Columbia University seismic center specifically states that= > their records do not support such a conclusion. > Source: > > --------------- > 27. Mayor Giuliani shipped off the remains of the World Trade Center > before anyone could look at it. > > Truth: FEMA, the FBI, the NTSB and the NIST all conducted in depth > investigations, including removal and testing of debris. An extensive > report is available at http://www.nist.gov/ > > > --------------- > 28. Claim: Not even FEMA was allowed into Ground Zero. > > Truth: False, they were involved in the investigation and even > produced the first report. > Source: > = > --------------- > 29. Claim: At the United 93 crash site =C3=A2=E2=82=AC=C5=93there was = nothing. Nothing > that you can distinguish that a plane had crashed there. =C3=A2=E2=82=AC= =C5=93 > > Truth: Extensive debris including engines, personal effects, body > parts and the black boxes were found at the crash site. Pictures of > many of these items were introduced into evidence as the Zacarias > Moussaoui trial. > Source: > > --------------- > 30. Claim: Wally Miller, a Somerset County coroner stated that there > were no bodies found at the crash site of United 93. > > Truth: There were no =C3=A2=E2=82=AC=C5=93whole=C3=A2=E2=82=AC=C2=9D b= odies, but over 1500 body parts were > found, and most of the passengers were identified through the use of > DNA. Mr. Miller later reported his findings on this. > Source: > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > You kooks also might want to look into the following: > 1) The pressurized diesel tank in WTC7's basement that fed an > emergency generator on the 5th floor... the line broke and spewed > diesel that fed the fire for hours. > > 2) The planes that hit the WTC towers were primarily constructed of > 2219-T81 aluminum... with a melting point of 950 F. Water in contact > with a catalyst can dissociate at much lower temperatures than the > ~3000 F necessary for catalyst-free dissociation. Molten aluminum is > such a catalyst. The prodigious quantities of plastic (petroleum > derived) in the towers thermally cracked, off-gassing combustibles > such as benzene, ethylene and naphtha, some of which burns as hot as > 3000 F. The molten aluminum ran down through the building, evaporating= > the water from the sprinklers and turning it into steam. The steam > rose back up through the building (still in contact with those > rivulets of molten aircraft frame aluminum) and came into contact with= > the fires from the plastics off-gassing and thus burning as hot as > 3000 F. The steam dissociated into oxygen and hydrogen (oxyhydrogen). > Oxyhydrogen can burn at upwards of 5070 F. It burns so hot it can melt= > quartz (which melts at up to 3115 F): > > > > 3) The planes (a Boeing 767-200 and Boeing 767-200ER) have a > factory-specified MTOW of 197.5 tons. After the fuel burned off, that > still leaves ~163.5 tons per plane. The floors, as I proved, were > already close to (if not slightly over) their 100 pound per square > foot load limit due to all the modernities in modern offices... just > what do you think adding an additional 163.5 *tons* of weight would do= > to those floor spars, especially given that the floor spars were in an= > inferno *and* had lost their viscoelastic dampers (and thus their > vertical means of perimeter support) in the area of the fire? > > 4) The lie that the WTC towers were the first in history to fall due > to fires is just that... a lie: > > Message-ID: > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D > There is a long list of buildings that have had the spray-on > insulation and suffered fire damage resulting in partial or complete > collapse. The McCormick Center, the Sight and Sound Theater, the Kader= > Toy Factory in Singapore, the Dogwood Elementary School in Virginia, > the Windsor Tower in Madrid, the Wisma Kosgoro in Jakarta, the Alexis > Nihon Plaza Montreal, One New York Plaza (connection bolts sheared > during fire, causing several steel filler beams on the 33-34th floors > to fall and rest on the bottom flanges of their supporting girders), > and several other examples. > > And the complete list. 22 multi-story buildings from 1970 to 2002 have= > collapsed solely from fire damage weakening their structural > integrity... 6 of them being steel-framed buildings, all of those 6 > being taller than 20 stories: > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D > > That you kooks cannot grasp the enormity of the forces involved leads > you to make false assumptions... and once emotionally invested in > your decision to remain uneducated, you continue to compound and > expand your stupidity and insanity, eventually culminating in the > hilariously wrong types of conclusions that kooks such as Michael > Scott Guthrie (aka Rocky) arrive at. This is the process that leads > you into insanity. > > Morons. > > > that was also the truth 15 years ago, idiot. what is your mental = malfunction that makes you think that anybody who is stupid enough to = latch on to any random conspiracy theory is going to suddenly grow an = extra brain cell and listen to you? you're dumber than emmett, burnore,= = and gerg thrown into an industrial size waring blender. -- = http://i.imgur.com/2tH6zVB.jpg http://cafepress.com/kooktown http://i.imgur.com/pnWqhSG.jpg If my poasts are offensive to you, you can always block all From: header= s = containing "root@127.0.0.1", unless you are an idiot who would like to = yammer about "morphing" and maybe try to lodge some frivolous complaints= = to my news provider, then please be sure to ignore this helpful = information and have fun making an ass of yourself in public. :) if that route of silencing those horrid opinions of mine that you = downloaded to your computer under duress doesn't work you can always try= : = http://i.imgur.com/jlsN9JX.png?2 http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Gish_Gallop The Gish Gallop is often used as an indirect argument from authority =E2= =80=94 as = it appears to paint the galloper as an expert in a broad range of subjec= ts = or with an extensive knowledge of an individual one. Simultaneously it = presents opponents (in spoken debates) or refuters (in written, = Internet-based ones) as incompetent bumblers who didn't do their homewor= k = before the debate. Such emphasis on style over substance is the reason = many scientists disdain public debates as a forum for disseminating = opinions. - Page #1 from the Gospel of SnickerTurd --