Path: csiph.com!usenet.pasdenom.info!dedibox.gegeweb.org!gegeweb.eu!nntpfeed.proxad.net!feeder1-2.proxad.net!proxad.net!feeder2-2.proxad.net!newsfeed.arcor.de!newsspool3.arcor-online.net!news.arcor.de.POSTED!not-for-mail Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Message-ID: <2748480.FELbIWn90F@PointedEars.de> From: Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn Reply-To: Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn Organization: PointedEars Software (PES) Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2014 22:24:47 +0100 User-Agent: KNode/4.11.3 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8Bit X-Face: %i>XG-yXR'\"2P/C_aO%~;2o~?g0pPKmbOw^=NT`tprDEf++D.m7"}HW6.#=U:?2GGctkL,f89@H46O$ASoW&?s}.k+&. <1fe2e508-cfc8-4933-997b-9bb462a2a593@googlegroups.com> <4250784.k5hfLq1mn1@PointedEars.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Lines: 79 NNTP-Posting-Date: 26 Jan 2014 22:25:06 CET NNTP-Posting-Host: b8df0a10.newsspool2.arcor-online.net X-Trace: DXC=OIFYd:9;M\]I?44J>Z[:RQA9EHlD;3YcR4Fo<]lROoRQ8kF Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote: >> Michael Haufe (TNO) wrote: > [...] >> > 4. Slower than equivalent JavaScript code >> >> Given that pure JavaScript has no way to access documents, what is that >> code you are talking about? > > The issue with the DOM forcing you into Immediate Mode whereas a ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > Retained Mode is more appropriate in many situations. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^ I am not aware of the DOM forcing me into anything. Please define those terms you just invented. > Hence the are countless articles on how avoid repaint/reflow through > manipulation of JavaScript objects creating a facsimile of the > document and/or divorced fragments which are then "committed" for > display after manipulation. It appears to be easy to avoid repaint/reflow: First build the subtree in memory, then append it. Which facsimiles are you talking about? Please elaborate. > If a web dev's bag of tricks contains a bullet point about "avoid the > DOM", then that is a smell if I ever smelled one. I am not sure that this even is an argument, let alone a sound one. > Also, doing for example BFS(myJSObjectDomFacsimile) is faster than ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > BFS(someDomElementUsingElementMemberMethods) as you are already ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > aware due to the numerous calls to an element's methods vs > reference walking in the first Please elaborate. >> > 5. A lack of necessary APIs >> >> As the DOM *is* an API, you must mean its (API) _features_. Such as? > > As listed here: How does this status document substantiate your argument? >> > 3. non-idiomatic usage >> >> Such as? > > While the other points are a repeat of arguments I've seen/heard, > this particular point is my opinion. The DOM is a leaky paradigm ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > that wants an Object-Oriented, imperative use. Since JavaScript > is not strongly in those camps, Am I to understand that you think JavaScript is not strong with regard to object-oriented, imperative use? If yes, how did you get that idea? With regard to programming paradigms, JavaScript is an object-oriented, procedural-imperative programming language, is it not? > there are impedance mismatches that occur, and it is common IME that code ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > tends to get warped to fit this API (or it grows overcomplicated wrappers ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > in libs and frameworks). This is another smell of bad design. Have you been spending too much time with the ties? Your arguments read like a winner’s game of Bullshit Bingo: You write much, but your words mean nothing. Please define your terminology (better: avoid it in the future) and elaborate on your arguments. -- PointedEars Twitter: @PointedEars2 Please do not Cc: me. / Bitte keine Kopien per E-Mail.