Path: csiph.com!eternal-september.org!feeder.eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Paul Rubin Newsgroups: comp.lang.forth Subject: Re: how can forth compete with lisp Date: Fri, 30 Sep 2016 17:14:21 -0700 Organization: A noiseless patient Spider Lines: 24 Message-ID: <87vaxd2aea.fsf@jester.gateway.pace.com> References: <8ceb459d-85bb-4a4d-9cbb-e8ea85c64b45@googlegroups.com> <948af228-1585-45da-b2dc-d7bc0508cd76@googlegroups.com> <88da2b1d-8944-4ba5-aa2c-fc3173af0c19@googlegroups.com> <28d5325f-34d1-4335-af20-5bc2adbc3d37@googlegroups.com> <3a6d2020-2892-4a45-891d-e0a67c0406d4@googlegroups.com> <87r3878zm3.fsf@jester.gateway.pace.com> <0oSdncYZpp6GKnTKnZ2dnUU7-S-dnZ2d@supernews.com> <1d004a18-4f8a-4983-addf-a02d76231bd8@googlegroups.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: mx02.eternal-september.org; posting-host="590ea01354cf4bcbcd857d7ebbd88128"; logging-data="25898"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX18i20oLXWxRTa0ofQIxHIir" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.3 (gnu/linux) Cancel-Lock: sha1:meL54ZATFtV5Ua7+ir/sA2RqPRA= sha1:FUpWyJxsSm4TECjB3zfk4QfxEDM= Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.forth:51496 lawrencedo99@gmail.com writes: >> They also hoped by doing the rewrite that they could find "$30/hr >> programmers on every streetcorner." > You may reasonably expect that with PHP and Java, but not with C. C is > not kind to mediocre programmers Well, we don't know how long ago that was. $30/hr used to be pretty good ;-). It also seems to me that kind or unkind as C might be, C programming doesn't pay very well around here compared with other languages these days. I talked with a guy whose company has a big C application and was surprised by the low salaries he was offering. > . http://arstechnica.com/security/2016/09/linux-kernel-security-needs-fixing/ Fwiw, I've written a lot of C in my life and more recently have been finding C++ to be much quicker and less bug-prone to program in than C. There's an efficiency hit (speed and memory) from using the STL containers etc., but it's nothing like the difference between C++ and scripting. I think a C++ programmer with a solid understanding of C is better off than a pure C programmer. If I were writing a kernel though, I'd give serious thought to using Ada, or maybe Rust when it gets more mature.