Path: csiph.com!eternal-september.org!feeder.eternal-september.org!nntp.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "Don" Newsgroups: sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: energy and mass Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2026 13:10:17 -0000 (UTC) Organization: A noiseless patient Spider Lines: 209 Message-ID: <20260226a@crcomp.net> References: <1rqdqrq.1rx7k5o10kkc3wN%liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid> <10na9a8$kc8a$1@dont-email.me> <1rqujx0.y1v3ks1h3x1j8N%nospam@de-ster.demon.nl> <5Iadnb2qI8JjgQT0nZ2dnZfqnPidnZ2d@giganews.com> <1rqvm2j.4swkko1es1k0vN%nospam@de-ster.demon.nl> <20260223a@crcomp.net> <10nikjj$n45p$1@gwaiyur.mb-net.net> <20260224a@crcomp.net> <10nmuit$1506i$1@gwaiyur.mb-net.net> <20260225a@crcomp.net> <10nn95o$15del$1@gwaiyur.mb-net.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Injection-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2026 13:10:19 +0000 (UTC) Injection-Info: dont-email.me; posting-host="be900264cd84e821341494473e18aec0"; logging-data="1754524"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX18orPJZ9wY2Zs1Pk7NG62Vs" Cancel-Lock: sha1:91t9pCkIVBpwFYBDda4LKEXI3yY= Xref: csiph.com sci.electronics.design:741036 Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote: > [F'up2 sci.physics.relativity again because special relativity was important > in the discussed discovery: The LHC, like all particle colliders is working > based on special relativity.] > > Don wrote: >> Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote: >>> Don wrote: >>>> Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote: >>>>> Don wrote: >>>>>> Pertinent passages pulled from THE HIGGS FAKE: HOW PARTICLE PHYSICS >>> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ >>>>>> FOOLED THE NOBEL COMMITTEE by Alexander Unzicker: >>>>> >>>>> [...] >>>>> >>>>>> Come out with a Number >>>>>> >>>>>> Today's scientists got widely used to cheap patches when >>>>>> it comes to fixing some contradiction in an ad-hoc manner, >>>>>> but the real problems fall into oblivion. Take, for >>>>>> instance, the fine structure constant, a combination of >>>>>> the constants c, e, ε0 and h. The number 137.035999... is, >>>>>> according to Richard Feynman, "one of the great damn >>>>>> mysteries of physics" and he recommended all good >>>>>> theoretical physicists should "put this number up on their >>>>>> wall and worry about it." [...] >>>>> >>>>> None of this has anything to do with the Brout--Englert--Higgs mechanism. >>> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ >>>>> Unzicker's whole argument is a fallacy, and so is yours. >>>> >>>> Please enlighten me as to your perception of my heretofore unstated >>>> argument. >>> >>> There is no "us" here. You are alone in your special kind of crackpottery. >>> >>>> USA situational poet laureate Edgar Allan Poe (EAP) disdained [...] >>>> Aristotelian and Platonic peerage group think. Instead, EAP highly valued >>>> Aristotelian and Platonic peerage group think. Instead, EAP highly valued >>>> individual independent intuitive leaps of imagination, as demonstrated >>>> by Kepler, Heaviside, and George Green demonstrated by Kepler, Heaviside, >>>> and George Green: [...] Albert Einstein commented [...] Julian Schwinger >>>> [...] published a tribute [...] >>> >>> Fallacy: /Ipse dixit./ >>> >>> The non-scientist Poe's opinion about science (if even true), and even the >>> physicists Einstein's and Schwinger's opinion about George Green (if true) >>> are irrelevant with regard to experimental confirmation of the >>> Brout--Englert--Higgs mechanism, for example, which has been done. >>> [...] >> >> Unzicker begins by bringing up your precious: > > You are merely arguing from your own ignorance and incompetence. > >> THE HIGGS MASS HYSTERIA >> IF ANYTHING, THE HYPE OF THE CENTURY >> >> On July 4, 2012, at the famous CERN seminar, scientists >> applauded, cheered, celebrated. The news spread quickly >> all over the world that the Higgs had been discovered >> (nobody cared about the subtleties of "the Higgs" and >> "a Higgs"), > > Plain false. Unzicker, in this fallacy of false equivalence, is falsely > equating the media hype about the discovery (including the media using the > terms "God Particle") with what scientists actually did and do. > >> allegedly the verification of an almost 50-year-old idea formulated >> by a Scottish theoretician. > > Instead, the idea that mass could be explained by symmetry breaking was > formulated by several theoretical physicists (NOT just "theoreticians"): > two teams, and Peter Higgs, who all worked independently: > > > > In your crackpottish hystery, it has completely escaped your attention that > I called it the "Brout--Englert--Higgs mechanism". This should already have > been indication to you that something is deeply wrong with Unzicker's > description. > >> [ex falso quodlibet] Au revoir, my formerly feisty foil. LHC's tearful team twinning - scientism's spontaneous segue into schmaltzy soap opera stuffed with metaphor: Chasing the Higgs ... Now it had come down to the Large Hadron Collider, where two armies of physicists, each 3,000 strong, struggled against each other and against nature, in a friendly but deadly serious competition. In physics tradition, they were there to check and complement each other in a $10 billion experiment too valuable to trust to only one group, no matter how brilliant and highly motivated. ... The stakes were more than just Nobel Prizes, bragging rights or just another quirkily named addition to the zoo of elementary particles that make up nature at its core. The Higgs boson would be the only visible manifestation of the Harry Potterish notion put forward back in 1964 (most notably by Peter Higgs of the University of Edinburgh) that there is a secret, invisible force field running the universe. (The other theorists were François Englert and Robert Brout, both of Université Libre de Bruxelles; and Tom Kibble of Imperial College, London, Carl R. Hagen of the University of Rochester and Gerald Guralnik of Brown University.) ... Everybody agreed that the Large Hadron Collider was the last stand in the hunt for the Higgs boson. Circling for 17 miles underneath the complex of aging postwar buildings outside Geneva (and out into France) that constitute the European Organization for Nuclear Research, or CERN, the collider was designed to accelerate the subatomic particles known as protons to more than 99 percent of the speed of light - an energy of seven trillion electron volts - and crash them together. ... Many physicists, Dr. Wu admits, thought that she herself had leaked the report. A year and a half later, she still found it hard to talk about the Easter event. "I was so excited I couldn't control my emotions," Dr. Wu recalled. She wrote the note as a way of alerting the Atlas community, she said. "I thought CMS would go on vacation and we could get ahead. I'm sorry I did that." ... While physicists fretted about the death of the Higgs, something was happening out in the wilds of uncertainty. One bump on physicists' charts, from the W bosons, was disappearing. But another was blooming like the shy girl at a dance. In retrospect, nobody could remember exactly when she had come in. But she was the one who would marry the prince. ... Back in Switzerland that same month, during a break when the Large Hadron Collider was not running, Dr. Gross took his girlfriend, Talia Levy Tytiun, down into the Atlas cavern. "I decided that I want to propose to Talia in the place which was the symbol of my life at this Higgs hunting period," he explained. "But believe me, I checked a thousand times with her before to make sure she will say yes." ... The gamma rays were still there, and had grown in significance, putting the boson on the verge of reality. Dr. Gianotti scrawled a note back: "Oh, my God." A week later, her team looked at another important decay channel, and her enthusiasm deflated. There was nothing. She spent a few days and nights with her "neurons spinning," she recalled, wondering how they could have been fooled. ... If nothing else, she thought, her talk would be a valentine to the passion and competence of the 3,000 Atlas scientists. ... "Every slide was a reward to the work of many, many people," she said. "So I was feeling so proud." "I think we have it," he said. The cheers began again. Dr. Higgs was seen wiping away tears. ... Dr. Wu waded through the crowd. She hugged Dr. Higgs. "I've been looking for you my whole life," she said. "Well," he replied, "now you have found me." -- 73, Don, KB7RPU veritas _|_ liberabit | https://www.qsl.net/kb7rpu vos |