Path: csiph.com!fu-berlin.de!bofh.it!news.nic.it!robomod From: Peter Bittner Newsgroups: linux.debian.maint.java Subject: Re: Debian package examples for Java software Date: Sun, 15 Sep 2024 17:10:01 +0200 Message-ID: References: X-Original-To: debian-java@lists.debian.org X-Mailbox-Line: From debian-java-request@lists.debian.org Sun Sep 15 15:06:13 2024 Old-Return-Path: X-Amavis-Spam-Status: No, score=-7.907 tagged_above=-10000 required=5.3 tests=[BAYES_00=-2, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, LDO_WHITELIST=-5, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Policyd-Weight: using cached result; rate: -5.5 X-Ui-Sender-Class: 724b4f7f-cbec-4199-ad4e-598c01a50d3a X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YyJomDKDGla2PjM6x17tNSZdLpPkNkPNRCfL/xEWER9kzsSIc/n 89tyzxmIJTbgMFhjpkRcPyb4gc/i1XsL7ZaUpjTPqMWzEN3RAVL/E9yyQf1qV0/uMVtYRFyb/YI KhT0oGanoai6omIcYTwFlukVZFT4/lzKkVtSc X-Google-SMTP-Source: AGHT+IE3NYrfA0IGJXM7NqR1qPc8s52psX/ogJYyXyz9vYNCTOptw55INv7LOrNs48HILAdNLS6Pe7QQovyurRpV8ao= X-Received: by 2002:a05:690c:620c:b0:6d5:6719:4d64 with SMTP id 00721157ae682-6dbcc2636f7mr79760437b3.18.1726412754851; Sun, 15 Sep 2024 08:05:54 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:aGgGD5YPzGNGVh09rmAbxZVrbqQ2fF6SgfxK0U+wRrh9vHgBA9G cg76EqAM0S/8W56yK5AN5KmAbJeqDbpOYf5glhDRn0kAg7dDsigr5/vM+uGmDlKhxIAI2fx X/4CO58M8Foopo0CUH7VDwtaZ47ztRs64LgA/H5yF9/xmrXUZQvdWD9rtoBxxu/JPfXBmMe X9xzWDRvSOg/tW8V1Vqww== Ui-Outboundreport: notjunk:1;M01:P0:GRDQBKbyiZY=;UsqO0FvRC+dxlb4YJzP5tRCm5r+ RyCo/XmKbnoZeDDMK+aadED08FEy1XdIdfnPfs2ZWdINITByhP2/yQezuaiLBxHTxC4KOpOKQ LXDVyHYcmIraMptx3rLYIRLbirZOeHIFLtglCxsh6T7RzPJTEzua9KLRG0QwI9B7pYdAtwe7k bd7xU4TxqOXNJQ3SDwk/yB2bN8qUnaDi94BVKP+yiUo6TAwJ619j9QnvciZhlUXpAebsNSKt1 v1wMkXY4De/lnHLCTzSQrWTwIn8+qw/IG8jcW9kVUanIkIEmT22A4cK6dhnUSnuJbKOQqRUJV XM4KgjKgEg6i/AdjKyeUVgznyL5SnXt4jwo2v+3aP8AE2BRGM7PRjg4PKaN6pD3qcZJkCPivX gj/sTyhebQjYIEnWE32wmfwigRbGJWn/LR1uSe9ik36nQzEhAYT5YrUywlLIBZ5K4bzD3ulVr VM1zwoZr51H+KXxamTa9sj90Qp9SNSj62CxLLooG1NX2r0s/ix1rO2nzj5CCM3cUI8oAoqT3I AY+oVGMCtvtb0ulGjQAaZ4kFfgNcCNNlcQlCFMY9NadMczbJ2TQSHMeoFVAV1iRuRDkThwh6T dOTxKDJPbHdq7OU/dx8/QvHkSiIetq95WaSvZsW/KFnnD5/xfJp8YSHbLutdLrinaMyvG7Zw6 i0CWC7KJbGpT4vkkzFqLuEe65zZWk3WdQ5qApXqP+2aADhM0ZffAwemRQo+fVtKtm00ftLtbs tR0trd2gIL4vWNMm9VEoLHva9NlbBN2TpGBq9zOmMsc8jGaBA6t/Y7022tS9Fx1YLcNgTfDyM UeqQSjJf1G+fjrV8AHy9+/nA== X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/23506 List-ID: List-URL: List-Archive: https://lists.debian.org/msgid-search/CAHywH5C+1RWw9dyUd3M51WAb4jc8fFCTh2jc3puPDs5z8M1aiQ@mail.gmail.com Approved: robomod@news.nic.it Lines: 55 Organization: linux.* mail to news gateway Sender: robomod@news.nic.it X-Original-Date: Sun, 15 Sep 2024 17:05:28 +0200 X-Original-Message-ID: X-Original-References: <8b94e20f-2d6d-4297-814b-9e4e18febb69@debian.org> Xref: csiph.com linux.debian.maint.java:12808 Dear all, Please, don't get me wrong. I'm a long-time Debian user and Open Source project maintainer. In my own projects I continuously struggle with the fact that an improvement in one project needs to be taken over to all the other projects. If you manage several (free software) projects yourself you may know this feeling: You try to improve the state of a repository, and you know you've done it before hence you want to avoid reinventing the wheel. But now you're unsure where the last place was where you had your latest and greatest solution (call it, "current best practice"). With that said, I know the tutorials on Debian packaging but I'm interested in actual, living implementation in popular projects, because that's where you learn current practices best from. People may perceive this as rude, but it certainly depends on how harsh or welcoming you want to be. I learned how to fish years ago, now I want advice from fishers. > What I would recommend in 2024 is that you package your software as a > private .deb =E2=80=94 which is fairly straightforward, even if you have > binary blobs that aren't built during the package build =E2=80=94 and the= n > install that inside a suitable base debian container image. I appreciate your advice, Michael. The point is, I didn't plan to come here to bore people with discussing my infrastructure implementation strategy. I don't think it belongs here. Using system packaging is exactly the intermediate step I want to use for going towards a cloud-native deployment for a nowadays traditionally deployed, VM-based setup. Intermediate steps are needed in environments that are reluctant to change. And not getting root-access is one component of the first equation of that change; having to cope with pre-installed components on the managed VM is another. But we're leaving the ground of Debian (and Open Source) here by far. I had hoped someone would point me to a good example of a popular project. One that delivers the final JAR, and a Debian maintainer takes care of packaging only. Maybe because the project doesn't care about having a Debian package at all. That would cut out the build part (Maven). I started my research with Geogebra, didn't find traces in their GitHub repositories (and it looks like they stopped promoting packages for Debian at all) and didn't know where to look for the original packaging code on Salsa. (I found it in the meantime at https://salsa.debian.org/java-team/geogebra) The colorpicker project (https://salsa.debian.org/java-team/colorpicker) seems dead-simple, but it builds from source. Is that good enough? The last code change is from 12 years ago. Thank you for your understanding, Peter