Path: csiph.com!fu-berlin.de!bofh.it!news.nic.it!robomod From: Emmanuel Bourg Newsgroups: linux.debian.maint.java Subject: Re: Kotlin and OpenJDK 8 in Bookworm? Date: Mon, 30 Jan 2023 00:40:01 +0100 Message-ID: References: X-Original-To: Thorsten Glaser X-Mailbox-Line: From debian-java-request@lists.debian.org Sun Jan 29 23:33:20 2023 Old-Return-Path: X-Amavis-Spam-Status: No, score=-7.02 tagged_above=-10000 required=5.3 tests=[BAYES_00=-2, LDO_WHITELIST=-5, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Policyd-Weight: using cached result; rate: -3.5 X-Greylist: delayed 1438 seconds by postgrey-1.36 at bendel; Sun, 29 Jan 2023 23:33:02 UTC MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Roundcube Webmail/1.4.13 X-Sender: ebourg@apache.org X-Originating-IP: 78.197.213.85 X-Webmail-Userid: ebourg-oss@ariane-software.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Ovh-Tracer-ID: 18197920194935388342 X-Vr-Spamstate: OK X-Vr-Spamscore: -100 X-Vr-Spamcause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedvhedrudefuddgtdekucetufdoteggodetrfdotffvucfrrhhofhhilhgvmecuqfggjfdpvefjgfevmfevgfenuceurghilhhouhhtmecuhedttdenucesvcftvggtihhpihgvnhhtshculddquddttddmnecujfgurhepggffhffvvefujghffgfkgihitgfgsehtkehjtddtreejnecuhfhrohhmpefgmhhmrghnuhgvlhcuuehouhhrghcuoegvsghouhhrghesrghprggthhgvrdhorhhgqeenucggtffrrghtthgvrhhnpedtveejueeugeehfffhtdelveevkeehtdevgeelvdejgfeufefgheehtdehffeuudenucfkphepuddvjedrtddrtddruddpjeekrdduleejrddvudefrdekhedpudejiedrfedurddvfedvrddutdelnecuvehluhhsthgvrhfuihiivgeptdenucfrrghrrghmpehinhgvthepuddvjedrtddrtddruddpmhgrihhlfhhrohhmpeeovggsohhurhhgsegrphgrtghhvgdrohhrgheqpdhnsggprhgtphhtthhopedupdhrtghpthhtohepuggvsghirghnqdhjrghvrgeslhhishhtshdruggvsghirghnrdhorhhgpdfovfetjfhoshhtpehmohehhedtpdhmohguvgepshhmthhpohhuth X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/23167 List-ID: List-URL: List-Archive: https://lists.debian.org/msgid-search/ff97d160d4639dee4b20bca6fdf3c198@apache.org Approved: robomod@news.nic.it Lines: 35 Organization: linux.* mail to news gateway Sender: robomod@news.nic.it X-Original-Cc: debian-java@lists.debian.org X-Original-Date: Mon, 30 Jan 2023 00:08:59 +0100 X-Original-Message-ID: X-Original-References: <298c5e7142ad9fc677f2f567242c8ea3@apache.org> <8ea25c60-6fb1-eee9-cc95-b773abad2f4a@tarent.de> Xref: csiph.com linux.debian.maint.java:12518 Le 2023-01-26 19:39, Thorsten Glaser a écrit : >> ineluctable truth: we need OpenJDK 8 back into the stable >> distribution. > > Not going to happen, sorry. This has been vetoed by the security > team and was the condition for keeping it in unstable at all. Are you opposed to this idea, or just pessimistic it could be accepted? I think it's important to highlight that the situation has evolved. We thought openjdk-8 was good enough in unstable only to bootstrap Kotlin and then move to a more recent JDK, but this isn't going to happen. Also there was an uncertainty on the lifetime of OpenJDK 8, but it's clear now that it'll be maintained for at least two more Debian releases. We have invested an insane amount of time in these Kotlin/Gradle issues, maintaining openjdk-8 in stable would require only a fraction of that. The longer we wait, the more likely we are going to paint ourself in a corner, with a completely broken and unmaintainable Gradle for example, or other elements in our tool chain that will no longer work with OpenJDK 8 and break even more the kotlin build. We still have some time to discuss this before the Bookworm release. I suggest that we let openjdk-8 transition to testing now before the beginning of the soft freeze, just to keep our options open. We won't expand the usage of kotlin during that time (no Gradle upgrade for example) such that the situation remains reversible before the release. Emmanuel Bourg