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El Capitan oddities

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  El Capitan oddities John Somerset <somerset@nospam.com> - 2015-10-05 19:45 -0400
    Re: El Capitan oddities nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-10-05 20:07 -0400
      Re: El Capitan oddities billy@MIX.COM - 2015-10-06 08:36 +0000
        Re: El Capitan oddities nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-10-06 10:08 -0400
      Re: El Capitan oddities Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-06 12:58 -0400
        Re: El Capitan oddities Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-06 17:19 +0000
          Re: El Capitan oddities Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-06 13:39 -0400
            Re: El Capitan oddities Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-06 17:54 +0000
              Re: El Capitan oddities Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-06 20:59 -0400
                Re: El Capitan oddities Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-07 00:59 +0000
                  Re: El Capitan oddities Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-07 18:54 -0400
                    Re: El Capitan oddities Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-08 00:21 +0000
                    Re: El Capitan oddities Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2015-10-07 17:57 -0700
                      Re: El Capitan oddities Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-08 17:24 +0000
                        Re: El Capitan oddities nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-10-08 13:27 -0400
                          Re: El Capitan oddities Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-08 17:31 +0000
                            Re: El Capitan oddities "Andre G. Isaak" <agisaak@gmail.com> - 2015-10-08 13:51 -0600
                              Re: El Capitan oddities Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-08 20:21 +0000
                              Re: El Capitan oddities dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2015-10-09 12:10 +1300
                                Re: El Capitan oddities Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-09 17:01 +0000
                        Re: El Capitan oddities Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2015-10-08 10:42 -0700
            Re: El Capitan oddities Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2015-10-06 16:25 -0700
              Re: El Capitan oddities nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-10-06 19:29 -0400
                Re: El Capitan oddities Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-07 00:10 +0000
                Re: El Capitan oddities Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2015-10-07 08:05 -0700
                  Re: El Capitan oddities nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-10-07 12:09 -0400
                    Re: El Capitan oddities Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2015-10-07 09:20 -0700
    Re: El Capitan oddities Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2015-10-06 13:09 +1300
    Re: El Capitan oddities Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2015-10-05 18:44 -0700
      Re: El Capitan oddities John Somerset <somerset@nospam.com> - 2015-10-06 00:58 -0400
        Re: El Capitan oddities Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> - 2015-10-05 22:09 -0700
          Re: El Capitan oddities John McWilliams <jpmcw@comcast.net> - 2015-10-05 22:44 -0700
        Re: El Capitan oddities Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2015-10-05 22:30 -0700
          Re: El Capitan oddities John Somerset <somerset@nospam.com> - 2015-10-06 04:30 -0400
    Re: El Capitan oddities xxx <xxx@yyy.zzz> - 2015-10-06 03:18 -0400
      Re: El Capitan oddities John Somerset <somerset@nospam.com> - 2015-10-06 05:41 -0400
        Re: El Capitan oddities nmassello@yahoo.com (Neill Massello) - 2015-10-06 08:42 -0600
          Re: El Capitan oddities Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2015-10-06 08:04 -0700
        Re: El Capitan oddities xxx <xxx@yyy.zzz> - 2015-10-06 20:35 -0400
      Re: El Capitan oddities Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-06 12:59 -0400
        Re: El Capitan oddities xxx <xxx@yyy.zzz> - 2015-10-06 20:32 -0400
          Re: El Capitan oddities Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-07 08:38 -0400
            Re: El Capitan oddities "Andre G. Isaak" <agisaak@gmail.com> - 2015-10-07 07:44 -0600
              Re: El Capitan oddities Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-07 19:00 -0400
                Re: El Capitan oddities "Andre G. Isaak" <agisaak@gmail.com> - 2015-10-07 20:52 -0600
                  Re: El Capitan oddities Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-08 08:40 -0400
                    Re: El Capitan oddities "Andre G. Isaak" <agisaak@gmail.com> - 2015-10-08 08:30 -0600
            Re: El Capitan oddities xxx <xxx@yyy.zzz> - 2015-10-08 01:54 -0400
              Re: El Capitan oddities John Somerset <somerset@nospam.com> - 2015-10-08 16:29 -0400
                Re: El Capitan oddities dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2015-10-09 14:09 +1300
                  Re: El Capitan oddities John Somerset <somerset@nospam.com> - 2015-10-08 22:08 -0400
                    Re: El Capitan oddities Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-09 09:38 -0400
                      Re: El Capitan oddities John Somerset <somerset@nospam.com> - 2015-10-09 12:38 -0400
                        Re: El Capitan oddities Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-10-09 17:08 +0000
                        Re: El Capitan oddities Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-09 13:25 -0400
                          Re: El Capitan oddities John Somerset <somerset@nospam.com> - 2015-10-09 22:59 -0400
                            Re: El Capitan oddities Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-10 09:48 -0400
                  Re: El Capitan oddities Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2015-10-09 12:30 +0100
    MenuMeters (Was: Re: El Capitan oddities) befr@eaglesoft.de (Bernd Fröhlich) - 2015-10-06 10:05 +0200
      Re: MenuMeters (Was: Re: El Capitan oddities) John Somerset <somerset@nospam.com> - 2015-10-06 05:43 -0400
    Re: El Capitan oddities Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-10-06 12:58 -0400
      Re: El Capitan oddities Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2015-10-06 16:13 -0700
        Re: El Capitan oddities John Somerset <somerset@nospam.com> - 2015-10-06 19:46 -0400
          Re: El Capitan oddities Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2015-10-06 17:10 -0700

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#82106

On 2015-10-06 16:59:40 +0000, Alan Browne said:

> On 2015-10-06 03:18, xxx wrote:
>> Some more oddities:
>> 
>> Mail no longer makes sounds, despite prefs setting
>> 
>> Mail checks for new mail every time you return to the program from
>> another desktop (workspace) or dashboard, regardless of the time elapsed
>> since the last check
>> 
>> External hard disk for backup no longer shows green Time Machine icon
> 
> Hasn't been green for a long time, fella.  10.7 (?)


    Mine was green until last week.

> 
>> 
>> Secure delete is gone
> 
> Doesn't make sense at all with SSD drives (unless srm is re-done) and 
> to a lesser extent doesn't make sense with FileVault activated.


    It was a convenience with individual files. You can still type rm 
-P, but the convenience is gone.


-- 
Klystron

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#82207

On 2015-10-06 20:32, xxx wrote:
> On 2015-10-06 16:59:40 +0000, Alan Browne said:
>
>> On 2015-10-06 03:18, xxx wrote:
>>> Some more oddities:
>>>
>>> Mail no longer makes sounds, despite prefs setting
>>>
>>> Mail checks for new mail every time you return to the program from
>>> another desktop (workspace) or dashboard, regardless of the time elapsed
>>> since the last check
>>>
>>> External hard disk for backup no longer shows green Time Machine icon
>>
>> Hasn't been green for a long time, fella.  10.7 (?)
>
>
>     Mine was green until last week.

What v. of the OS?

>
>>
>>>
>>> Secure delete is gone
>>
>> Doesn't make sense at all with SSD drives (unless srm is re-done) and
>> to a lesser extent doesn't make sense with FileVault activated.
>
>
>     It was a convenience with individual files. You can still type rm
> -P, but the convenience is gone.


There is no coordination between srm and SSD firmware that assures 
you're writing over the actual data in its physical location.

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#82212

In article <ErKdnXB_s5DFj4jLnZ2dnUU7-cOdnZ2d@giganews.com>,
 Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> wrote:

> On 2015-10-06 20:32, xxx wrote:
> > On 2015-10-06 16:59:40 +0000, Alan Browne said:
> >
> >> On 2015-10-06 03:18, xxx wrote:
> >>> Some more oddities:
> >>>
> >>> Mail no longer makes sounds, despite prefs setting
> >>>
> >>> Mail checks for new mail every time you return to the program from
> >>> another desktop (workspace) or dashboard, regardless of the time elapsed
> >>> since the last check
> >>>
> >>> External hard disk for backup no longer shows green Time Machine icon
> >>
> >> Hasn't been green for a long time, fella.  10.7 (?)
> >
> >
> >     Mine was green until last week.
> 
> What v. of the OS?

Mine was green under 10.10.5. It's still green under 10.11.

Andre

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#82414

On 2015-10-07 09:44, Andre G. Isaak wrote:
> In article <ErKdnXB_s5DFj4jLnZ2dnUU7-cOdnZ2d@giganews.com>,
>   Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> wrote:
>
>> On 2015-10-06 20:32, xxx wrote:
>>> On 2015-10-06 16:59:40 +0000, Alan Browne said:
>>>
>>>> On 2015-10-06 03:18, xxx wrote:
>>>>> Some more oddities:
>>>>>
>>>>> Mail no longer makes sounds, despite prefs setting
>>>>>
>>>>> Mail checks for new mail every time you return to the program from
>>>>> another desktop (workspace) or dashboard, regardless of the time elapsed
>>>>> since the last check
>>>>>
>>>>> External hard disk for backup no longer shows green Time Machine icon
>>>>
>>>> Hasn't been green for a long time, fella.  10.7 (?)
>>>
>>>
>>>      Mine was green until last week.
>>
>> What v. of the OS?
>
> Mine was green under 10.10.5. It's still green under 10.11.

Om the desktop perhaps, but not in a Finder view.  I haven't had volumes 
or disks showing on the desktop in ages and assumed most people had 
abandoned that ...

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#82473

In article <nNednSXVzoNuPojLnZ2dnUU7-U-dnZ2d@giganews.com>,
 Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> wrote:

> On 2015-10-07 09:44, Andre G. Isaak wrote:
> > In article <ErKdnXB_s5DFj4jLnZ2dnUU7-cOdnZ2d@giganews.com>,
> >   Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> wrote:
> >
> >> On 2015-10-06 20:32, xxx wrote:
> >>> On 2015-10-06 16:59:40 +0000, Alan Browne said:
> >>>
> >>>> On 2015-10-06 03:18, xxx wrote:
> >>>>> Some more oddities:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Mail no longer makes sounds, despite prefs setting
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Mail checks for new mail every time you return to the program from
> >>>>> another desktop (workspace) or dashboard, regardless of the time elapsed
> >>>>> since the last check
> >>>>>
> >>>>> External hard disk for backup no longer shows green Time Machine icon
> >>>>
> >>>> Hasn't been green for a long time, fella.  10.7 (?)
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>      Mine was green until last week.
> >>
> >> What v. of the OS?
> >
> > Mine was green under 10.10.5. It's still green under 10.11.
> 
> Om the desktop perhaps, but not in a Finder view.  I haven't had volumes 
> or disks showing on the desktop in ages and assumed most people had 
> abandoned that ...

I'm talking about the Finder. I don't have disks on the desktop either. 
Or are you perhaps talking about the grey sidebar icons rather than the 
icons one gets in the uppermost Finder window and/or /Volumes?

Andre

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#82498

On 2015-10-07 22:52, Andre G. Isaak wrote:
> In article <nNednSXVzoNuPojLnZ2dnUU7-U-dnZ2d@giganews.com>,
>   Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> wrote:
>
>> On 2015-10-07 09:44, Andre G. Isaak wrote:
>>> In article <ErKdnXB_s5DFj4jLnZ2dnUU7-cOdnZ2d@giganews.com>,
>>>    Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 2015-10-06 20:32, xxx wrote:
>>>>> On 2015-10-06 16:59:40 +0000, Alan Browne said:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 2015-10-06 03:18, xxx wrote:
>>>>>>> Some more oddities:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Mail no longer makes sounds, despite prefs setting
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Mail checks for new mail every time you return to the program from
>>>>>>> another desktop (workspace) or dashboard, regardless of the time elapsed
>>>>>>> since the last check
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> External hard disk for backup no longer shows green Time Machine icon
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hasn't been green for a long time, fella.  10.7 (?)
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>       Mine was green until last week.
>>>>
>>>> What v. of the OS?
>>>
>>> Mine was green under 10.10.5. It's still green under 10.11.
>>
>> Om the desktop perhaps, but not in a Finder view.  I haven't had volumes
>> or disks showing on the desktop in ages and assumed most people had
>> abandoned that ...
>
> I'm talking about the Finder. I don't have disks on the desktop either.
> Or are you perhaps talking about the grey sidebar icons rather than the
> icons one gets in the uppermost Finder window and/or /Volumes?

So many places ...

Yep, I mean in the Finder view sidebar which is (generally) the only 
place I see volumes.  If I back all the way out in finder to the "Mac" 
then, yes, TM is green (10.11 and back).  I rarely look at the system 
from that view though.  My apologies for my assumptions.

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#82502

In article <zo-dnRL6AOuo-YvLnZ2dnUU7-TednZ2d@giganews.com>,
 Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> wrote:

> On 2015-10-07 22:52, Andre G. Isaak wrote:
> > In article <nNednSXVzoNuPojLnZ2dnUU7-U-dnZ2d@giganews.com>,
> >   Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> wrote:
> >
> >> On 2015-10-07 09:44, Andre G. Isaak wrote:
> >>> In article <ErKdnXB_s5DFj4jLnZ2dnUU7-cOdnZ2d@giganews.com>,
> >>>    Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> On 2015-10-06 20:32, xxx wrote:
> >>>>> On 2015-10-06 16:59:40 +0000, Alan Browne said:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> On 2015-10-06 03:18, xxx wrote:
> >>>>>>> Some more oddities:
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Mail no longer makes sounds, despite prefs setting
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Mail checks for new mail every time you return to the program from
> >>>>>>> another desktop (workspace) or dashboard, regardless of the time 
> >>>>>>> elapsed
> >>>>>>> since the last check
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> External hard disk for backup no longer shows green Time Machine icon
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Hasn't been green for a long time, fella.  10.7 (?)
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>       Mine was green until last week.
> >>>>
> >>>> What v. of the OS?
> >>>
> >>> Mine was green under 10.10.5. It's still green under 10.11.
> >>
> >> Om the desktop perhaps, but not in a Finder view.  I haven't had volumes
> >> or disks showing on the desktop in ages and assumed most people had
> >> abandoned that ...
> >
> > I'm talking about the Finder. I don't have disks on the desktop either.
> > Or are you perhaps talking about the grey sidebar icons rather than the
> > icons one gets in the uppermost Finder window and/or /Volumes?
> 
> So many places ...
> 
> Yep, I mean in the Finder view sidebar which is (generally) the only 
> place I see volumes.

Yes, that one is definitely not green. I don't remember when that 
stopped being green but its been awhile.

> If I back all the way out in finder to the "Mac" 
> then, yes, TM is green (10.11 and back).  I rarely look at the system 
> from that view though.  My apologies for my assumptions.

On further reflection, I realise that I was wrong. My TM volume isn't 
green at all -- it's very clearly teal.

Andre

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#82490

On 2015-10-07 12:38:48 +0000, Alan Browne said:

> On 2015-10-06 20:32, xxx wrote:
>> On 2015-10-06 16:59:40 +0000, Alan Browne said:
>> 
>>> On 2015-10-06 03:18, xxx wrote:
>>>> Some more oddities:
>>>> 
>>>> Mail no longer makes sounds, despite prefs setting
>>>> 
>>>> Mail checks for new mail every time you return to the program from
>>>> another desktop (workspace) or dashboard, regardless of the time elapsed
>>>> since the last check
>>>> 
>>>> External hard disk for backup no longer shows green Time Machine icon
>>> 
>>> Hasn't been green for a long time, fella.  10.7 (?)
>> 
>> 
>> Mine was green until last week.
> 
> What v. of the OS?


    Through the last version of Yosemite.


-- 
Klystron

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#82578

On 10/8/15 1:54 AM, xxx wrote:
> On 2015-10-07 12:38:48 +0000, Alan Browne said:
>
>> On 2015-10-06 20:32, xxx wrote:
>>> On 2015-10-06 16:59:40 +0000, Alan Browne said:
>>>
>>>> On 2015-10-06 03:18, xxx wrote:
>>>>> Some more oddities:
>>>>>
>>>>> Mail no longer makes sounds, despite prefs setting
>>>>>
>>>>> Mail checks for new mail every time you return to the program from
>>>>> another desktop (workspace) or dashboard, regardless of the time
>>>>> elapsed
>>>>> since the last check
>>>>>
>>>>> External hard disk for backup no longer shows green Time Machine icon
>>>>
>>>> Hasn't been green for a long time, fella.  10.7 (?)
>>>
>>>
>>> Mine was green until last week.
>>
>> What v. of the OS?
>
>
>     Through the last version of Yosemite.
>
>
I got TM when I got a new Mac with 10.8.  I don't remember ever seeing 
the TM disk icon green.

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#82664

John Somerset <somerset@nospam.com> wrote:

> On 10/8/15 1:54 AM, xxx wrote:
> > On 2015-10-07 12:38:48 +0000, Alan Browne said:
> >
> >> On 2015-10-06 20:32, xxx wrote:
> >>> On 2015-10-06 16:59:40 +0000, Alan Browne said:
> >>>
> >>>> On 2015-10-06 03:18, xxx wrote:
> >>>>> Some more oddities:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> External hard disk for backup no longer shows green Time Machine icon
> >>>>
> >>>> Hasn't been green for a long time, fella.  10.7 (?)
> >>>
> >>> Mine was green until last week.
> >>
> >> What v. of the OS?
> >
> >     Through the last version of Yosemite.
> >
> I got TM when I got a new Mac with 10.8.  I don't remember ever seeing
> the TM disk icon green.

The desktop icon of my directly connected TM backup drive (or the one in
the Go > Computer view) has been green since I first started using TM
when it was introduced in Mac OS X 10.5 (Leopard), and it is still green
in Mac OS X 10.10.5 (Yosemite).

The Finder sidebar icon was also green until the system version which
decided everything needed to be grey (presumably Yosemite). It still
shows the TM reversed clock on the drive icon.

I've observed that in some situations the backup drive icon looks like a
normal removable drive after it is mounted, until TM does an automatic
backup, at which point it changes to the green icon. If you only ever do
manual TM backups, the icon won't be green.

A networked TM backup may look different.

If you have a custom icon on the backup drive, it will probably override
the automatic one used by the system (including the green TM icon).

I haven't had a TM drive connected to El Capitan yet, so haven't seen if
it changes the icon behaviour.

-- 
David Empson
dempson@actrix.gen.nz

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#82673

On 10/8/15 9:09 PM, David Empson wrote:
> John Somerset <somerset@nospam.com> wrote:
>
>> On 10/8/15 1:54 AM, xxx wrote:
>>> On 2015-10-07 12:38:48 +0000, Alan Browne said:
>>>
>>>> On 2015-10-06 20:32, xxx wrote:
>>>>> On 2015-10-06 16:59:40 +0000, Alan Browne said:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 2015-10-06 03:18, xxx wrote:
>>>>>>> Some more oddities:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> External hard disk for backup no longer shows green Time Machine icon
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hasn't been green for a long time, fella.  10.7 (?)
>>>>>
>>>>> Mine was green until last week.
>>>>
>>>> What v. of the OS?
>>>
>>>      Through the last version of Yosemite.
>>>
>> I got TM when I got a new Mac with 10.8.  I don't remember ever seeing
>> the TM disk icon green.
>
> The desktop icon of my directly connected TM backup drive (or the one in
> the Go > Computer view) has been green since I first started using TM
> when it was introduced in Mac OS X 10.5 (Leopard), and it is still green
> in Mac OS X 10.10.5 (Yosemite).
>
> The Finder sidebar icon was also green until the system version which
> decided everything needed to be grey (presumably Yosemite). It still
> shows the TM reversed clock on the drive icon.
>
> I've observed that in some situations the backup drive icon looks like a
> normal removable drive after it is mounted, until TM does an automatic
> backup, at which point it changes to the green icon. If you only ever do
> manual TM backups, the icon won't be green.
>
> A networked TM backup may look different.
>
> If you have a custom icon on the backup drive, it will probably override
> the automatic one used by the system (including the green TM icon).
>
> I haven't had a TM drive connected to El Capitan yet, so haven't seen if
> it changes the icon behaviour.
>
That's it. I've never taken the plunge to automatic backups.

I'm scared of the trouble I might get into if I encrypted my disk.

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#82733

On 2015-10-08 22:08, John Somerset wrote:

> That's it. I've never taken the plunge to automatic backups.

Trivially easy.  And once set up and running, all but noticeable in 
operation, esp. with high speed interfaces (Firewire or faster).

>
> I'm scared of the trouble I might get into if I encrypted my disk.

Trivially low risk and removes any "end of disk life" issues wrt 
destroying data.  Just make a copy of the recovery key and keep in a 
safe place.

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#82763

On 10/9/15 9:38 AM, Alan Browne wrote:
> On 2015-10-08 22:08, John Somerset wrote:
>
>> That's it. I've never taken the plunge to automatic backups.
>
> Trivially easy.  And once set up and running, all but noticeable in
> operation, esp. with high speed interfaces (Firewire or faster).

It's a carryover from System 7.  A power interruption could make a disk 
unreadable, IIRC.  I kept my backup drive turned off normally so a power 
problem wouldn't corrupt it along with my internal disk.  Maybe 
journaling has made the risk negligible.
>
>>
>> I'm scared of the trouble I might get into if I encrypted my disk.
>
> Trivially low risk and removes any "end of disk life" issues wrt
> destroying data.  Just make a copy of the recovery key and keep in a
> safe place.
>
How does encryption prevent loss of data?

Is the recovery key normally a password created by the user?

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#82777

John Somerset <somerset@nospam.com> wrote:
> On 10/9/15 9:38 AM, Alan Browne wrote:
>> On 2015-10-08 22:08, John Somerset wrote:
>> 
>>> That's it. I've never taken the plunge to automatic backups.
>> 
>> Trivially easy.  And once set up and running, all but noticeable in
>> operation, esp. with high speed interfaces (Firewire or faster).
> 
> It's a carryover from System 7.  A power interruption could make a disk 
> unreadable, IIRC.  I kept my backup drive turned off normally so a power 
> problem wouldn't corrupt it along with my internal disk.  Maybe 
> journaling has made the risk negligible.

It has, but that's also what uninterruptible power supplies are designed
for.

>>> I'm scared of the trouble I might get into if I encrypted my disk.
>> 
>> Trivially low risk and removes any "end of disk life" issues wrt
>> destroying data.  Just make a copy of the recovery key and keep in a
>> safe place.
>> 
> How does encryption prevent loss of data?

You can throw the drive away without bothering to erase it first as long as
you throw away / destroy the encryption key.

> Is the recovery key normally a password created by the user?

No, it is a long alphanumeric string automatically created by Apple when
you enable FileVault.

-- 
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR 

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#82782

On 2015-10-09 12:38, John Somerset wrote:
> On 10/9/15 9:38 AM, Alan Browne wrote:
>> On 2015-10-08 22:08, John Somerset wrote:
>>
>>> That's it. I've never taken the plunge to automatic backups.
>>
>> Trivially easy.  And once set up and running, all but noticeable in
>> operation, esp. with high speed interfaces (Firewire or faster).
>
> It's a carryover from System 7.  A power interruption could make a disk
> unreadable, IIRC.  I kept my backup drive turned off normally so a power
> problem wouldn't corrupt it along with my internal disk.  Maybe
> journaling has made the risk negligible.

Many things make it negligible.  I've had power failures during writes 
and no issues afterwards other than files that needed to be copied again.

You can also get a UPS to keep your disks up during writes - further, 
they have power failure management s/w to terminate tasks on the mac 
during power failures that last more than x minutes.  (Although I don't 
know how gracefully TM exits if writing at that time.  OTOH, once a TM 
volume is initialized, hourly updates take little time).


>>
>>>
>>> I'm scared of the trouble I might get into if I encrypted my disk.
>>
>> Trivially low risk and removes any "end of disk life" issues wrt
>> destroying data.  Just make a copy of the recovery key and keep in a
>> safe place.
>>
> How does encryption prevent loss of data?
>
> Is the recovery key normally a password created by the user?

No.  It's gen'd by FileVault.  24 chars (similar to a s/w license key).

Note that you would normally keep the Filevault key in your keychain 
which requires password access.  eg: when you log in to your mac, the HD 
Filevault key is retrieved via keychain.

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#82899

On 10/9/15 1:25 PM, Alan Browne wrote:
> On 2015-10-09 12:38, John Somerset wrote:
>> On 10/9/15 9:38 AM, Alan Browne wrote:
>>> On 2015-10-08 22:08, John Somerset wrote:
>>>
>>>> That's it. I've never taken the plunge to automatic backups.
>>>
>>> Trivially easy.  And once set up and running, all but noticeable in
>>> operation, esp. with high speed interfaces (Firewire or faster).
>>
>> It's a carryover from System 7.  A power interruption could make a disk
>> unreadable, IIRC.  I kept my backup drive turned off normally so a power
>> problem wouldn't corrupt it along with my internal disk.  Maybe
>> journaling has made the risk negligible.
>
> Many things make it negligible.  I've had power failures during writes
> and no issues afterwards other than files that needed to be copied again.
>
> You can also get a UPS to keep your disks up during writes - further,
> they have power failure management s/w to terminate tasks on the mac
> during power failures that last more than x minutes.  (Although I don't
> know how gracefully TM exits if writing at that time.  OTOH, once a TM
> volume is initialized, hourly updates take little time).
>
A few months ago, the household lights blinked, but my Mini and 
LED-backlight monitor kept going.  I was impressed. If my Mini had been 
powering a USB drive, maybe it wouldn't have kept running.  I guess 
corrupting a backup disk would probably be an inconvenience, not a disaster.

>
>>>
>>>>
>>>> I'm scared of the trouble I might get into if I encrypted my disk.
>>>
>>> Trivially low risk and removes any "end of disk life" issues wrt
>>> destroying data.  Just make a copy of the recovery key and keep in a
>>> safe place.
>>>
>> How does encryption prevent loss of data?
>>
>> Is the recovery key normally a password created by the user?
>
> No.  It's gen'd by FileVault.  24 chars (similar to a s/w license key).
>
> Note that you would normally keep the Filevault key in your keychain
> which requires password access.  eg: when you log in to your mac, the HD
> Filevault key is retrieved via keychain.
>
>
I've found a page on Filevault.
http://osxdaily.com/2013/05/22/filevault-disk-encryption-mac/

I was worried about what a power interruption could do.  It says I'd 
have to restart the computer. If the disk needed repair, I wonder if 
that would be a problem with Filevault.

It says with a 5400 rpm drive, I might see slower performance. I guess 
I'd have to try it to find out.

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#82916

On 2015-10-09 22:59, John Somerset wrote:
> On 10/9/15 1:25 PM, Alan Browne wrote:

>> You can also get a UPS to keep your disks up during writes - further,
>> they have power failure management s/w to terminate tasks on the mac
>> during power failures that last more than x minutes.  (Although I don't
>> know how gracefully TM exits if writing at that time.  OTOH, once a TM
>> volume is initialized, hourly updates take little time).
>>
> A few months ago, the household lights blinked, but my Mini and
> LED-backlight monitor kept going.  I was impressed. If my Mini had been
> powering a USB drive, maybe it wouldn't have kept running.  I guess
> corrupting a backup disk would probably be an inconvenience, not a
> disaster.

>>> Is the recovery key normally a password created by the user?
>>
>> No.  It's gen'd by FileVault.  24 chars (similar to a s/w license key).
>>
>> Note that you would normally keep the Filevault key in your keychain
>> which requires password access.  eg: when you log in to your mac, the HD
>> Filevault key is retrieved via keychain.
>>
>>
> I've found a page on Filevault.
> http://osxdaily.com/2013/05/22/filevault-disk-encryption-mac/
>
> I was worried about what a power interruption could do.  It says I'd
> have to restart the computer. If the disk needed repair, I wonder if
> that would be a problem with Filevault.

Millions of people use FileVault.  It's not something you hear many 
issues about.

>
> It says with a 5400 rpm drive, I might see slower performance. I guess
> I'd have to try it to find out.

The slowdown would only appear on very large/long writes.  It's very 
much worth whatever slowdown occurs.

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#82730

In article <1mc1073.1tjqeu81n66be1N%dempson@actrix.gen.nz>, David
Empson <dempson@actrix.gen.nz> wrote:

>I've observed that in some situations the backup drive icon looks like a
>normal removable drive after it is mounted, until TM does an automatic
>backup, at which point it changes to the green icon.

Exactly my experience with Firewire-connected TM drives. Mine are also
green. Running 10.9.5.

-- 
Lady Astor: "If you were my husband I'd give you poison." Churchill: "If
you were my wife, I'd drink it."

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#81786 — MenuMeters (Was: Re: El Capitan oddities)

John Somerset <somerset@nospam.com> wrote:

> Menu Meters Wouldn't work. I found that the Raging Menace guy had
> announced last summer that it wouldn't work with El Capitan beta, and he'd
> given up trying to work with Apple.  Then I found a Japanese site whose
> author said Apple had blocked it because of a term in the programming.  He
> substituted another term, and it worked fine.

I guess you mean this:
<http://member.ipmu.jp/yuji.tachikawa/MenuMetersElCapitan/>

I contacted the author of MenuMeters and asked him if he could use that
fix in the official version. Here is his answer:

> Thanks, the author has contacted me and I'm aware of his changes.
> However, I'm hoping to keep full menu extra functionality on 10.11,
> and have some promising results. Hopefully I'll have something to announce
> soon.

Sounds good to me.

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#81790 — Re: MenuMeters (Was: Re: El Capitan oddities)

On 10/6/15 4:05 AM, Bernd Fröhlich wrote:
> John Somerset <somerset@nospam.com> wrote:
>
>> Menu Meters Wouldn't work. I found that the Raging Menace guy had
>> announced last summer that it wouldn't work with El Capitan beta, and he'd
>> given up trying to work with Apple.  Then I found a Japanese site whose
>> author said Apple had blocked it because of a term in the programming.  He
>> substituted another term, and it worked fine.
>
> I guess you mean this:
> <http://member.ipmu.jp/yuji.tachikawa/MenuMetersElCapitan/>
>
> I contacted the author of MenuMeters and asked him if he could use that
> fix in the official version. Here is his answer:
>
>> Thanks, the author has contacted me and I'm aware of his changes.
>> However, I'm hoping to keep full menu extra functionality on 10.11,
>> and have some promising results. Hopefully I'll have something to announce
>> soon.
>
> Sounds good to me.
>
That's the one.  Thanks.

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