Re: [OT] I won!

From	Don Bruder <dakidd@sonic.net>
Newsgroups	comp.sys.mac.system
Subject	Re: [OT] I won!
Date	2015-08-23 16:20 -0700
Organization	Chaotic Creations Unlimited
Message-ID	<mrdkcf$miv$1@dont-email.me> (permalink)
References	(6 earlier) <220820151456553972%michelle@michelle.org> <55d9235b$0$32297$c3e8da3$cc4fe22d@news.astraweb.com> <18adnXlkn6P7VUTInZ2dnUU7-N-dnZ2d@giganews.com> <mrcrnv$n7i$1@news.albasani.net> <mrdfap$5pr$1@dont-email.me>

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In article <mrdfap$5pr$1@dont-email.me>,
 John McWilliams <jpmcw@comcast.net> wrote:

> On 8/23/15   PDT 9:18 AM, Albert Hirsch wrote:
> > On 8/23/15 9:19 AM, Alan Browne wrote:
> 
> >> Because "premium" fuels do not deliver improved mileage in proportion to
> >> their price increase they market the fuels with added 'cleaners' and so
> >> on in a value proposition bid.  (you might get 1 or 2% more mileage but
> >> the price difference is much greater than 1 or 2%).
> >>
> >
> > If you stick to Top Tier-certified fuel, the detergent additive packages
> > in all grades are identical. Most major US and some Canadian brands meet
> > Top Tier standards.
> >
> > So the premium grade gas pump gives you a higher octane rating (i.e.,
> > more knock-resistance), that's all. Back in the day, premium grade often
> > did have better additives.
> 
> Does not higher octane have more bang for the buck? I.e., more BTU's or 
> other measurement of virility. Therefor, it will give better mileage, 
> though maybe not enough to cover cost over lower ocatane mixes.

No. It does not.

*PRACTICALLY SPEAKING* (there are several other factors, but to anybody 
other than a tech weenie, they don't matter), "higher octane" equals 
"It's not as likely to go bang in the cylinder unless and until a spark 
is applied". Higher octane fuel is "harder to light" than a lower octane 
fuel. Because of this, a lower octane fuel is more prone to 
knock/pre-ignition and what's called "run-on" or "dieseling" - I'm sure 
you've probably encountered it - where you turn off the key in a gas 
powered vehicle, and instead of shutting off, the engine keeps lurching 
along for a while. 

Everything else being equal, higher/lower octane has no effect on the 
power an engine can produce. A given engine can be fiddled with in 
various ways so that a given amount of fuel produces a certain amount of 
power, but doing so *USUALLY* involves jacking up the compression ratio. 
Increasing compression means that the fuel/air charge *WILL* get hotter 
than the same charge in a lower compression engine. That higher 
temperature MAY be enough to cause the charge to ignite before the 
piston is at the top of its stroke, which, among other things (possibly 
including catastrophic failure - Ever heard the phrase "blew a rod"?) 
will rob some power from the engine's output.

Using a higher octane fuel, the compression can be cranked much higher 
without needing to worry about knock/pre-ignition and/or blowing a 
piston out the bottom of the engine.

-- 
Security provided by Mssrs Smith and/or Wesson. Brought to you by the letter Q

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[OT]  I won! Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2015-08-21 18:11 -0700
  Re: [OT]  I won! Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-08-22 01:15 +0000
    Re: [OT]  I won! Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2015-08-21 18:43 -0700
      Re: [OT]  I won! Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-08-22 02:20 +0000
        Re: [OT] I won! Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-08-22 09:48 -0400
  Re: [OT]  I won! JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2015-08-21 23:09 -0400
    Re: [OT]  I won! Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2015-08-21 20:57 -0700
      Re: [OT]  I won! Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-08-22 04:02 +0000
        Re: [OT]  I won! Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2015-08-21 21:19 -0700
      Re: [OT]  I won! JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2015-08-22 00:08 -0400
        Re: [OT]  I won! Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2015-08-21 21:22 -0700
          Re: [OT]  I won! JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2015-08-22 00:34 -0400
            Re: [OT]  I won! Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2015-08-21 23:00 -0700
              Re: [OT]  I won! JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2015-08-22 12:15 -0400
                Re: [OT]  I won! Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2015-08-22 14:58 -0700
            Re: [OT]  I won! Davoud <star@sky.net> - 2015-08-22 22:55 -0400
              Re: [OT]  I won! Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> - 2015-08-22 20:10 -0700
          Re: [OT]  I won! Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-08-22 15:38 +0000
            Re: [OT]  I won! Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2015-08-22 14:56 -0700
              Re: [OT]  I won! Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-08-23 00:45 +0000
              Re: [OT]  I won! JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2015-08-22 21:35 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! John McWilliams <jpmcw@comcast.net> - 2015-08-22 20:20 -0700
                Re: [OT] I won! Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2015-08-22 21:33 -0700
                Re: [OT] I won! JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2015-08-23 11:18 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> - 2015-08-24 23:19 +0000
                Re: [OT] I won! Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-08-25 01:10 +0000
                Re: [OT] I won! JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2015-08-24 21:36 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! Lloyd Parsons <lloydp211@gmail.com> - 2015-08-25 03:26 +0000
                Re: [OT] I won! Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-08-25 11:47 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! Lloyd Parsons <lloydp211@gmail.com> - 2015-08-25 17:36 +0000
                Re: [OT] I won! Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-08-25 14:36 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! Lloyd Parsons <lloydp211@gmail.com> - 2015-08-25 21:20 +0000
                Re: [OT] I won! Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-08-25 17:22 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! Lloyd Parsons <lloydp211@gmail.com> - 2015-08-25 21:38 +0000
                Re: [OT] I won! Warren Oates <warren.oates@gmail.com> - 2015-08-26 07:33 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! Lloyd Parsons <lloydp211@gmail.com> - 2015-08-26 12:43 +0000
                Re: [OT] I won! Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-08-26 19:01 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! Lloyd Parsons <lloydp211@gmail.com> - 2015-08-26 23:40 +0000
                Re: [OT] I won! Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-08-26 20:10 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! Lloyd Parsons <lloydp211@gmail.com> - 2015-08-27 01:23 +0000
                Re: [OT] I won! Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-08-27 08:43 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! Lloyd Parsons <lloydp211@gmail.com> - 2015-08-27 12:50 +0000
                Re: [OT] I won! "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> - 2015-08-27 01:20 +0000
                Re: [OT] I won! Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-08-25 11:44 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> - 2015-08-27 01:17 +0000
                Re: [OT] I won! Don Bruder <dakidd@sonic.net> - 2015-08-26 20:52 -0700
                Re: [OT] I won! dorayme <do_ray_me@bigpond.com> - 2015-08-27 16:46 +1000
                Re: [OT] I won! Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-08-27 08:45 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2015-08-27 11:20 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-08-27 16:58 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-08-27 08:43 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-08-27 08:40 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-08-23 09:19 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! Albert Hirsch <doc@treadstone.net> - 2015-08-23 12:18 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! John McWilliams <jpmcw@comcast.net> - 2015-08-23 14:54 -0700
                Re: [OT] I won! Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2015-08-23 15:14 -0700
                Re: [OT] I won! Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-08-23 22:58 +0000
                Re: [OT] I won! Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-08-24 12:20 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! Don Bruder <dakidd@sonic.net> - 2015-08-23 16:20 -0700
                Re: [OT] I won! Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-08-24 12:21 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2015-08-23 21:17 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-08-24 12:19 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-08-24 11:52 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2015-08-24 11:55 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-08-24 16:00 +0000
                Re: [OT] I won! JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2015-08-24 12:22 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2015-08-24 09:37 -0700
                Re: [OT] I won! JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2015-08-24 12:41 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2015-08-24 12:52 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2015-08-24 10:43 -0700
                Re: [OT] I won! nmassello@yahoo.com (Neill Massello) - 2015-08-24 12:25 -0600
                Re: [OT] I won! Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-08-24 18:53 +0000
                Re: [OT] I won! Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-08-24 16:40 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! Bruce Esquibel <bje@ripco.com> - 2015-08-25 13:37 +0000
                Re: [OT] I won! Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2015-08-24 09:23 -0700
                Re: [OT] I won! Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-08-24 12:17 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2015-08-24 09:23 -0700
        Re: [OT] I won! Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-08-22 09:55 -0400
          Re: [OT] I won! Lloyd Parsons <lloydp211@gmail.com> - 2015-08-22 14:52 +0000
            Re: [OT] I won! Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-08-22 20:13 -0400
              Re: [OT] I won! JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2015-08-22 21:30 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2015-08-23 13:57 +1200
              Re: [OT] I won! Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2015-08-22 20:00 -0700
              Re: [OT] I won! Lloyd Parsons <lloydp211@gmail.com> - 2015-08-23 12:37 +0000
                Re: [OT] I won! Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-08-23 09:21 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-08-23 09:50 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! Lloyd Parsons <lloydp211@gmail.com> - 2015-08-23 13:57 +0000
      Re: [OT]  I won! ErikRS <mac-dane@is.invalid> - 2015-08-22 13:31 +0200
        Re: [OT]  I won! Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2015-08-22 06:56 -0700
        Re: [OT]  I won! "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> - 2015-08-23 18:52 +0000
      Re: [OT]  I won! George Kerby <ghost_topper@hotmail.com> - 2015-08-23 12:16 -0500
        Re: [OT]  I won! Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2015-08-23 12:19 -0700
          Re: [OT]  I won! TaliesinSoft <taliesinsoft@me.com> - 2015-08-23 19:17 -0500
            Re: [OT]  I won! Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2015-08-23 17:25 -0700
              Re: [OT] I won! John McWilliams <jpmcw@comcast.net> - 2015-08-23 22:18 -0700
        Re: [OT]  I won! Don Bruder <dakidd@sonic.net> - 2015-08-23 13:32 -0700
          Re: [OT]  I won! George Kerby <ghost_topper@hotmail.com> - 2015-08-25 08:23 -0500
            Re: [OT]  I won! Huge <Huge@nowhere.much.invalid> - 2015-08-25 13:36 +0000
            Re: [OT]  I won! Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2015-08-25 06:58 -0700
              Re: [OT]  I won! George Kerby <ghost_topper@hotmail.com> - 2015-08-26 14:50 -0500
                Re: [OT]  I won! George Kerby <ghost_topper@hotmail.com> - 2015-08-27 14:34 -0500
    Re: [OT]  I won! Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2015-08-22 18:27 +1200
  Re: [OT] I won! Tester Estes <no_email@invalid.invalid> - 2015-08-22 04:06 +0000
    Re: [OT] I won! Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2015-08-22 18:28 +1200
  Re: [OT] I won! Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-08-22 09:46 -0400
    Re: [OT] I won! Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-08-22 09:57 -0400
      Re: [OT] I won! Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2015-08-22 07:02 -0700
        Re: [OT] I won! Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-08-22 20:11 -0400
          Re: [OT] I won! Warren Oates <warren.oates@gmail.com> - 2015-08-23 14:55 -0400
            Re: [OT] I won! Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2015-08-23 12:26 -0700
              Re: [OT] I won! Warren Oates <warren.oates@gmail.com> - 2015-08-24 11:08 -0400
              Re: [OT] I won! Warren Oates <warren.oates@gmail.com> - 2015-08-24 11:09 -0400
              Re: [OT] I won! Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-08-24 12:22 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2015-08-24 09:25 -0700
                Re: [OT] I won! Warren Oates <warren.oates@gmail.com> - 2015-08-24 13:17 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-08-24 16:43 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! "M. John Matlaw" <nouser@invalid.com> - 2015-08-25 08:12 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-08-25 11:47 -0400
                Re: [OT] I won! "M. John Matlaw" <nouser@invalid.com> - 2015-08-25 12:27 -0400
    Re: [OT] I won! Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> - 2015-08-22 07:34 -0700
      Re: [OT] I won! Alan Browne <alan.browne@freelunchvideotron.ca> - 2015-08-22 20:11 -0400
      Re: [OT] I won! George Kerby <ghost_topper@hotmail.com> - 2015-08-23 12:26 -0500
        Re: [OT] I won! Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> - 2015-08-23 13:34 -0700
    Re: [OT] I won! George Kerby <ghost_topper@hotmail.com> - 2015-08-23 12:24 -0500
  Re: [OT]  I won! android <here@there.was> - 2015-08-23 07:44 +0200
    Re: [OT]  I won! Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2015-08-23 17:59 +1200
      Re: [OT]  I won! android <here@there.was> - 2015-08-23 08:18 +0200
      Re: [OT]  I won! Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2015-08-23 06:02 -0700
      Re: [OT]  I won! George Kerby <ghost_topper@hotmail.com> - 2015-08-23 12:21 -0500
        Re: [OT]  I won! Huge <Huge@nowhere.much.invalid> - 2015-08-23 17:23 +0000

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