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Groups > comp.sys.apple2.programmer > #2042

Re: telnetd for GNO?

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Jeff Blakeney wrote:
> On 04/01/2016 1:57 PM, D Finnigan wrote:
>> I realize that I'm not hitting the real point of your query! :-0
>> But I was thinking about the "tangle" you mentioned, and how it might be
>> better solved now with the Uthernet II. And how this new approach may
>> allow
>> many more interesting TCP/IP applications to be written for any operating
>> environment on the IIgs, whether in GNO or for the traditional desktop.
> 
>  At present, there is no library 
> to use the Uthernet II's TCP/IP stack so it would have to be done for 
> each individual program until someone creates a library. 

The reason why there is no library yet is probably because the Uthernet II
has only been out in the fields for about 3 months. We are still learning
it.

Someone will write that library. 


> But if someone 
> does create a library it would be best implemented the way Marinetti has 
> done it so that it can be used by any application using the IIgs toolbox.

Yes, I agree. It would be incredibly shortsighted not to write the library
as a drop-in replacement for the Marinetti tool.

The measure of success is that you delete Marinetti from your system,
install this new library, and you can use Spectrum Internet Suite and SAFE2
as if nothing had changed.


> 
> Writing a new library to directly access the Uthernet II's TCP/IP stack 
> doesn't make much sense as Marinetti is already written and available 
> for use and is already being used by dozens of programs. 

It makes tons of sense as Marinetti is nearly 20 years old, and in that time
hasn't been significantly updated to account for new and revised RFCs since
the late 1990s.

Furthermore, it's an incomplete implementation of some of the protocols,
such as IP. Did you know that Marinetti has no method for routing IP
datagrams to either a host on the local link or to a gateway? That's because
when Richard Bennett wrote the original thing in the 1990s, he assumed a
single connection at the other end of the IIgs. It means that link layers
such as the LanceGS (the first one) have had to write their own IP routing
algorithm, as well as their own ARP implementation and DHCP client too.

Furthermore, writing a lightweight interface for the Uthernet II's TCP/IP
stack on the W5100 will mean less RAM needed on the IIgs. It will probably
also be much faster, since the IP, UDP, TCP, and ICMP checksums will all be
computed in the W5100 hardware and not on the IIgs.


> It is possible 
> that Marinetti could be pared down substantially and rewritten to use 
> the Uthernet II's stack but then you can't use Marinetti with Uthernet 
> I, LANceGS and Apple Ethernet cards or with a serial PPP or SLIP
> connection.

Who is using other connection methods besides the Uthernet or Uthernet II?

Raise your hands, people.

People with their hands raised can continue using Marinetti. But the
hundreds of people who now own an Uthernet II will be glad to use a drop-in
replacement for Marinetti that uses far less RAM and has fewer bugs and has
better RFC compliance.


> I haven't looked into it but I have heard that there are some 
> limitations to the Uthernet II's TCP/IP stack.  I believe someone 
> mentioned it only supported 4 open sockets at a time.  These limitations 
> might not be so bad with an 8 bit Apple II but could cause problems with 
> the 16 bit IIgs.

Yes, 4 sockets is the maximum.

Can you think of any applications on the IIgs that use more than 4
connections? I can't. I know FTP clients use two connections. What else is
there?

Here's a list of all the applications that I know about for Marinetti:
- DNS resolver
- Telnet
- Casper (HTTP server)
- Spectrum Internet Suite (web browser and email client)
- SAM2 (email client)
- SAFE2 (FTP client)
- GWFTP (FTP client)
- SNAP (Usenet newsreader)
- Arachnid (web browser)
- Samurai (IRC client)
- gsAIM (AOL Instant Messenger client)
- Silver Platter (HTTP server)
- ping
- whois
- finger
- ifconfig
- Marlene (telnet client)
- Telnetti (telnet client)
- Telnet NDA
- QServer NDA (Quote of Day server)
- Spectrum (telecomms client)
- Net Time (NTP client)
- RamRunTime (NTP client)
- IItter (Twitter client)
- MailChecker NDA (POP3 client, returns inbox count)
- DictioNDA (online dictionary client)

From: http://macgui.com/kb/article/764

-- 
]DF$
The Marina IP stack for Apple II--
http://marina.a2hq.com/

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telnetd for GNO? stlhood <stlhood@gmail.com> - 2016-01-03 14:00 -0800
  Re: telnetd for GNO? D Finnigan <dog_cow@macgui.com> - 2016-01-04 16:27 +0000
    Re: telnetd for GNO? stlhood <stlhood@gmail.com> - 2016-01-04 10:50 -0800
      Re: telnetd for GNO? D Finnigan <dog_cow@macgui.com> - 2016-01-04 18:57 +0000
        Re: telnetd for GNO? Jeff Blakeney <CUTjeffrey_blakeney@yahoo.ca> - 2016-01-04 18:56 -0500
          Re: telnetd for GNO? D Finnigan <dog_cow@macgui.com> - 2016-01-05 20:44 +0000
            Re: telnetd for GNO? andrew.roughan@writeme.com - 2016-01-06 03:21 -0800
              Re: telnetd for GNO? D Finnigan <dog_cow@macgui.com> - 2016-01-07 22:51 +0000
            Re: telnetd for GNO? Kelvin Sherlock <email@domain.com> - 2016-01-06 12:45 -0500
            Re: telnetd for GNO? Jeff Blakeney <CUTjeffrey_blakeney@yahoo.ca> - 2016-01-06 17:12 -0500
              Re: telnetd for GNO? D Finnigan <dog_cow@macgui.com> - 2016-01-07 23:05 +0000
                Re: telnetd for GNO? "Bill Garber" <willy46pa@comcast.net> - 2016-01-07 21:43 -0500
                Re: telnetd for GNO? andrew.roughan@writeme.com - 2016-01-09 00:58 -0800
                Re: telnetd for GNO? D Finnigan <dog_cow@macgui.com> - 2016-01-09 21:30 +0000
  Re: telnetd for GNO? Stephen Heumann <stephen.heumann@gmail.com> - 2016-01-04 18:45 -0600
    Re: telnetd for GNO? stlhood <stlhood@gmail.com> - 2016-01-04 20:40 -0800
      Re: telnetd for GNO? Stephen Heumann <stephen.heumann@gmail.com> - 2016-01-10 12:30 -0600
        Re: telnetd for GNO? stlhood <stlhood@gmail.com> - 2016-01-10 21:28 -0800
          Re: telnetd for GNO? Steven Hirsch <snhirsch@gmail.com> - 2016-01-11 13:03 -0500
            Re: telnetd for GNO? D Finnigan <dog_cow@macgui.com> - 2016-01-11 18:41 +0000
              Re: telnetd for GNO? Steven Hirsch <snhirsch@gmail.com> - 2016-01-11 19:05 -0500
                Re: telnetd for GNO? D Finnigan <dog_cow@macgui.com> - 2016-01-12 18:56 +0000
    Re: telnetd for GNO? D Finnigan <dog_cow@macgui.com> - 2016-01-05 20:56 +0000
      Re: telnetd for GNO? stlhood <stlhood@gmail.com> - 2016-01-06 00:18 -0800

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