Re: stacks are not hard, The joy of FORTRAN-like languages

From	John Levine <johnl@taugh.com>
Newsgroups	alt.folklore.computers, comp.os.linux.misc
Subject	Re: stacks are not hard, The joy of FORTRAN-like languages
Date	2024-10-04 03:49 +0000
Organization	Taughannock Networks
Message-ID	<vdnol1$255q$1@gal.iecc.com> (permalink)
References	<pan$96411$d204da43$cc34bb91$1fe98651@linux.rocks> <vdantp$1knbl$1@dont-email.me> <3XqKO.347651$WOde.64018@fx09.iad> <1780944966.749420156.476631.peter_flass-yahoo.com@news.eternal-september.org>

Cross-posted to 2 groups.

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According to Peter Flass  <peter_flass@yahoo.com>:
>> The subroutine calling convention required the calling program
>> to pass a pointer to a register save area.  A recursive routine
>> would have to allocate a save area in each instance (and, of
>> course, free it before exiting).  If they wanted local variables,
>> they'd have to allocate and free them as well.
>
>Presumably local variables would be allocated together with the save area.
>All the assembler code I wrote used GETMAIN/FREEMAIN, then I had a
>head-slapping moment a few years ago when someone said “just allocate a big
>chunk of memory and allocate save areas from it to eliminate lots of SVCs.”
>Of course this only makes sense when your assembler code has lots of
>internal calls, not for small stand-alone subroutines.

That's essentially what PL/I did.  The save areas and local variables were
allocated from a big chunk of memory, and when it ran out, the subroutine
prolog called an internal PL/I routine to get a new chunk and chain them
together.  Read all about it here starting on page 158:

https://bitsavers.org/pdf/ibm/360/pli/C28-6594-4_PL1_F_Programmers_Guide_Nov68.pdf

And for the PL/I subset on the tiny 360/20, it starts on page 200:

https://bitsavers.org/pdf/ibm/360/model20/C33-6007-1_360-20_PLI_Dec68.pdf

I hear that Algol F did GETMAIN/FREEMAIN at every block or procedure
entry and exit.  Someone at Princeton hacked it to suballocate from
larger chunks and vastly improved runtime performance.
-- 
Regards,
John Levine, johnl@taugh.com, Primary Perpetrator of "The Internet for Dummies",
Please consider the environment before reading this e-mail. https://jl.ly

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Re: The joy of FORTRAN Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-09-27 17:43 +0000
  Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-27 23:30 +0000
    Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-09-28 02:20 +0000
      Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-28 02:22 +0000
      Re: The joy of FORTRAN The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-28 07:42 +0100
        Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-28 07:37 +0000
      Re: The joy of FORTRAN Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2024-09-28 07:07 -0400
        Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-09-28 19:36 +0000
          Re: The joy of FORTRAN The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-28 22:04 +0100
            Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2024-09-28 21:20 +0000
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-28 22:28 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-09-29 03:11 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-29 07:22 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-09-29 19:56 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2024-09-30 10:01 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-30 18:39 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2024-09-30 11:15 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-10-01 13:45 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2024-10-01 08:02 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-30 14:19 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-09-29 04:26 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-29 05:17 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-09-30 05:46 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-30 05:53 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-30 14:19 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-30 13:17 +0100
                Re: The joy of ALGOL-like languages Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-30 21:37 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-30 14:19 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-30 23:25 +0000
                Re: stacks are not hard, The joy of FORTRAN-like languages John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2024-10-04 03:49 +0000
                Re: stacks are not hard, The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-04 03:51 +0000
                Re: stacks are not hard, The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2024-10-04 17:07 -1000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-29 07:26 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-29 13:15 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-30 13:11 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-30 14:19 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Rich Alderson <news@alderson.users.panix.com> - 2024-09-30 16:51 -0400
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> - 2024-09-30 20:58 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-30 21:33 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2024-09-30 19:03 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Rich Alderson <news@alderson.users.panix.com> - 2024-10-01 16:53 -0400
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Rich Alderson <news@alderson.users.panix.com> - 2024-10-01 16:39 -0400
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-09-30 23:10 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Rich Alderson <news@alderson.users.panix.com> - 2024-10-01 17:36 -0400
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages geodandw <geodandw@gmail.com> - 2024-09-28 17:41 -0400
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Niklas Karlsson <nikke.karlsson@gmail.com> - 2024-09-28 21:44 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-29 07:06 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages geodandw <geodandw@gmail.com> - 2024-09-29 02:57 -0400
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-29 08:34 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-09-29 19:39 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-29 23:25 +0000
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2024-09-28 15:17 -0700
                7-bit encodings (was: Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages) Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-29 00:36 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-09-29 03:15 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-29 07:16 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-09-29 19:29 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-29 23:24 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-09-30 16:31 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-30 18:12 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages scott@alfter.diespammersdie.us (Scott Alfter) - 2024-09-30 21:26 +0000
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-29 13:15 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-30 13:10 +0100
            Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-09-29 03:01 +0000
            Re: The joy of FORTRAN vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> - 2024-09-29 07:58 +0000
              Into the woods of business Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2024-09-29 07:11 -0700
                Re: Into the woods of business vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> - 2024-09-29 20:02 +0000
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-09-29 20:09 +0000
  Re: The joy of FORTRAN Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-28 10:29 -0700
    Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-28 21:41 +0000
    Re: The joy of FORTRAN Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-09-29 04:26 +0000
      Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-29 05:26 +0000
        Re: The joy of FORTRAN Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-09-30 05:46 +0000
          Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-30 05:54 +0000
          Re: The joy of FORTRAN Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-30 14:19 -0700
            Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-30 23:26 +0000
            Re: The joy of FORTRAN Harold Stevens <wookie@aspen.localdomain> - 2024-10-01 03:52 -0500
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN Louis Krupp <lkrupp@invalid.pssw.com.invalid> - 2024-10-01 15:49 -0600
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Harold Stevens <wookie@aspen.localdomain> - 2024-10-01 18:04 -0500
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Louis Krupp <lkrupp@invalid.pssw.com.invalid> - 2024-10-02 03:12 -0600
      Re: The joy of FORTRAN The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-29 07:27 +0100

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