Re: Batteries and mains, going solo.

From	"Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid>
Newsgroups	comp.os.linux.misc, alt.comp.os.windows-11
Subject	Re: Batteries and mains, going solo.
Date	2025-09-12 12:36 +0200
Message-ID	<sl9dplx61i.ln2@Telcontar.valinor> (permalink)
References	(21 earlier) <FeWcnfZIe7-Av1_1nZ2dnZfqn_adnZ2d@giganews.com> <2reaplxhh2.ln2@Telcontar.valinor> <yAKdnW5PM8RgMF_1nZ2dnZfqn_ednZ2d@giganews.com> <pfdbplxq54.ln2@Telcontar.valinor> <oNGcnWl65oSLMF71nZ2dnZfqn_idnZ2d@giganews.com>

Cross-posted to 2 groups.

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On 2025-09-12 07:18, c186282 wrote:
> On 9/11/25 1:28 PM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
>> On 2025-09-11 13:09, c186282 wrote:
>>> On 9/11/25 4:45 AM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
>>>> On 2025-09-11 03:12, c186282 wrote:

...

>>>> My AC might have a trifasic motor, or perhaps a brushless DC motor. 
>>>> The fridge claims to have a linear motor, which I understand is not 
>>>> rotating, but some kind of piston and an electromagnet moving it 
>>>> forward and back, at a variable frequency.
>>>
>>>    Piston compressors are quite rare these days - they are
>>>    more expensive, more little parts. Even thus you also
>>>    need a proper pressure differential between the high
>>>    and low pressure sides of the refrigerant loop in order
>>>    to get good thermodynamic efficiency. You can't just
>>>    run even a piston compressor at one-tenth speed because
>>>    you won't get that optimal pressure differential.
>>>
>>>    Review the owners manual or post a link.
>>
>> Search "LG Linear Inverter fridge", or ask chatgpt to explain them :-)
> 
>    I'll never talk to "Chat" ....

It works better than google for searching information that is out there 
somewhere. Saves time.

> 
>    According to the propaganda, the fridge varies the
>    compressor speed. This can only work properly by
>    adding an extra, variable, expansion valve - which
>    is a breakdown point fer-sure. Enough probs with
>    "stupid" expansion valves already.
> 
>    Read up on how refrigeration works. You have to
>    compress the gas down to liquid - and suck off
>    the resultant heat - then expand it back to vapor
>    to absorb heat. The pressure ratio is important.
>    Anything outside a fairly narrow envelope and
>    efficiency plunges.

I'm familiar. I participated in the building of a test machine for 
verification and maintenance of the AC installed on some trains. I was 
the software guy.

> 
>>>    Peltier chips CAN be run on pulsed DC - but they are
>>>    seriously low-efficiency power-wise. Require just stupid
>>>    amperage. Tried to build a micro-fridge using those
>>>    one time ...
>>
>> They do exist, commercially. For cars. Plug into the car cigarette 
>> plug. Can be used to heat the food when you arrive at your picnic 
>> site :-D
>>
>> https://www.amazon.es/dp/B0F4Y52V4D/
>>
>> https://www.amazon.es/dp/B0BX9Q2MH6/
>>
>> https://es.aliexpress.com/item/1005008678105686.html
> 
>    Yep, seen them. DID get some of the chips and tried
>    to make my own. Alas the power transformer (they pref
>    about 14 volts DC) was several times heavier than the
>    attempted mini-fridge.
> 
>    NOT efficient ! Maybe someday.
> 
>    For NOW, pumping refrigerant though fat/skinny
>    tubes under pressure IS the best option. Suggest
>    NOT using propane (burns!) or ammonia (toxic!).
>    Freon-12 was ideal ... but Al Gore's people
>    ruined that.

In the EU, the law mandates what gases you can not use. So 
butane/propane and other gases that burn are a certain possibility.

> 
>    Oh, read recently, a smaller "ozone hole"
>    means MORE "global warming" :-)
> 
>>>    Well-made piston compressors are, or were, "better"
>>>    IMHO - could last 30+ years. Alas the quality went
>>>    down over time and then everybody switched to the
>>>    scroll type. Did find an ancient Norge in a country
>>>    store some years back - piston compressor, radiator
>>>    coil on top. Still worked.
>>>
>>>> I did not say that they will work with either 50 or 60 Hz, but that 
>>>> they might. Not going to test it!
> 
>    The impedance of the motor/transformer windings is
>    usually tuned to the expected mains Hz. Run a higher
>    freq to a 50hz motor and you'll get both excessive
>    heating and lower power xfer. 50 into 60 and you
>    won't get much heating BUT still lower power xfer.
> 
>    In short, the goal is "electronic harmony". It's "music".


But these machines are actually inverter driven with variable frequency. 
It is a fact.

Aside from the rectifier.


-- 
Cheers, Carlos.
ES🇪🇸, EU🇪🇺;

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Re: Real-time OSs (Re: Microsoft Is Abandoning Windows 11 SE) Daniel70 <daniel47@somewhere.someplaceelse> - 2025-09-06 22:41 +1000
  Re: Real-time OSs (Re: Microsoft Is Abandoning Windows 11 SE) "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-09-06 15:41 +0200
    Re: Real-time OSs (Re: Microsoft Is Abandoning Windows 11 SE) Daniel70 <daniel47@somewhere.someplaceelse> - 2025-09-08 00:00 +1000
      Batteries and mains, going solo. "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-09-08 23:17 +0200
        Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. not@telling.you.invalid (Computer Nerd Kev) - 2025-09-09 08:41 +1000
          Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-09-09 02:56 +0200
            Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-09-09 04:49 -0400
        Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. Daniel70 <daniel47@somewhere.someplaceelse> - 2025-09-10 22:14 +1000
          Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-09-10 14:18 +0200
            Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. Daniel70 <daniel47@somewhere.someplaceelse> - 2025-09-10 23:49 +1000
              Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-09-10 20:58 +0200
              Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-09-10 15:35 -0400
                Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-09-10 21:55 +0200
                Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-09-10 17:11 -0400
                Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-09-11 02:10 +0200
                Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-09-10 21:12 -0400
                Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-09-11 10:45 +0200
                Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-09-11 07:09 -0400
                Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-09-11 19:28 +0200
                Fridge Freezers (was: Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. "Kerr-Mudd, John" <admin@127.0.0.1> - 2025-09-11 21:20 +0100
                Re: Fridge Freezers "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-09-12 00:51 +0200
                Re: Fridge Freezers (was: Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-09-12 02:27 -0400
                Re: Fridge Freezers (was: Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. "Kerr-Mudd, John" <admin@127.0.0.1> - 2025-09-12 09:42 +0100
                Re: Fridge Freezers (was: Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-09-12 06:26 -0400
                Re: Fridge Freezers The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-09-12 15:39 +0100
                Re: Fridge Freezers Daniel70 <daniel47@somewhere.someplaceelse> - 2025-09-13 19:45 +1000
                Re: Fridge Freezers The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-09-13 11:22 +0100
                Re: Fridge Freezers (was: Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2025-09-13 18:26 +0000
                Re: Fridge Freezers The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-09-12 15:29 +0100
                Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-09-12 01:18 -0400
                Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-09-12 12:36 +0200
                Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. Daniel70 <daniel47@somewhere.someplaceelse> - 2025-09-13 19:53 +1000
                Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-09-13 11:24 +0100
                Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. Farley Flud <fflud@gnu.rocks> - 2025-09-13 13:13 +0000
                Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-09-13 17:21 +0100
                Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. Farley Flud <ff@linux.rocks> - 2025-09-13 18:20 +0000
                Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2025-09-14 20:06 +1000
                Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-09-14 17:45 +0100
                Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2025-09-14 20:04 +1000
                Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-09-14 17:42 +0100
                Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2025-09-13 14:17 +0000
                Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. Mark Lloyd <not.email@all.invalid> - 2025-09-11 18:20 +0000
                Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-09-12 02:14 -0400
              Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-09-11 10:45 +0100
                Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. Daniel70 <daniel47@somewhere.someplaceelse> - 2025-09-11 21:15 +1000
                Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. Graham J <nobody@nowhere.co.uk> - 2025-09-11 13:52 +0100
                Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-09-11 15:17 +0100
                Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-09-11 23:59 -0400
                Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. Lars Poulsen <lars@cleo.beagle-ears.com> - 2025-09-13 14:05 +0000
                Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2025-09-14 20:14 +1000
                Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-09-11 19:31 +0200
                Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-09-12 01:31 -0400
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                Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. Mark Lloyd <not.email@all.invalid> - 2025-09-11 18:42 +0000
                Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-09-12 07:21 +0100
                Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-09-12 12:40 +0200
                Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. Mark Lloyd <not.email@all.invalid> - 2025-09-12 21:02 +0000
            Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-09-10 15:19 -0400
              Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. Mark Lloyd <not.email@all.invalid> - 2025-09-11 18:34 +0000
                Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-09-12 02:20 -0400
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                Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-09-13 00:15 -0400
            Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-09-12 15:20 +0100
              Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-09-12 10:43 -0400
              Re: Batteries and mains, going solo. "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-09-13 01:22 +0200
  Re: Real-time OSs (Re: Microsoft Is Abandoning Windows 11 SE) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-09-06 14:09 -0400
    Re: Real-time OSs (Re: Microsoft Is Abandoning Windows 11 SE) "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-09-07 04:32 +0200
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