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Groups > comp.lang.python > #72180 > unrolled thread
| Started by | Larry Martell <larry.martell@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| First post | 2014-05-28 14:23 -0500 |
| Last post | 2014-05-31 09:28 -0800 |
| Articles | 20 on this page of 324 — 57 participants |
Back to article view | Back to comp.lang.python
Python 3 is killing Python Larry Martell <larry.martell@gmail.com> - 2014-05-28 14:23 -0500
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Johannes Bauer <dfnsonfsduifb@gmx.de> - 2014-05-28 21:39 +0200
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-05-28 22:41 +0300
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-05-28 12:49 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Larry Martell <larry.martell@gmail.com> - 2014-05-28 14:58 -0500
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2014-05-29 03:49 +0000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-05-28 21:23 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Larry Martell <larry.martell@gmail.com> - 2014-05-29 06:38 -0500
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-05-29 06:15 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-05-28 21:24 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python wxjmfauth@gmail.com - 2014-05-28 23:14 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2014-07-14 15:12 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python mm0fmf <none@mailinator.com> - 2014-07-14 23:37 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python MRAB <python@mrabarnett.plus.com> - 2014-07-14 23:47 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2014-07-14 18:00 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-15 11:18 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-15 09:28 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2014-07-14 18:54 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-15 12:11 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2014-07-14 21:18 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-15 14:40 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Martin S <shieldfire@gmail.com> - 2014-07-15 06:31 +0200
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2014-07-15 05:41 +0000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Tim Roberts <timr@probo.com> - 2014-07-16 20:18 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2014-07-16 22:15 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Gregory Ewing <greg.ewing@canterbury.ac.nz> - 2014-07-17 17:36 +1200
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-17 15:45 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-17 15:45 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-07-15 08:05 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python alister <alister.nospam.ware@ntlworld.com> - 2014-07-15 12:30 +0000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-07-15 00:59 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python alister <alister.nospam.ware@ntlworld.com> - 2014-07-15 12:19 +0000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python MRAB <python@mrabarnett.plus.com> - 2014-07-15 15:50 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python alister <alister.nospam.ware@ntlworld.com> - 2014-07-15 17:38 +0000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2014-07-15 18:23 +0000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-07-15 16:35 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Ben Finney <ben@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-05-29 08:38 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-05-28 16:22 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python beliavsky@aol.com - 2014-08-06 06:47 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2014-08-06 14:42 -0400
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-08-07 12:42 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-08-07 13:37 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Dennis Lee Bieber <wlfraed@ix.netcom.com> - 2014-08-07 21:07 -0400
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2014-05-28 21:57 -0400
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Steve Hayes <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> - 2014-05-31 12:07 +0200
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Johannes Bauer <dfnsonfsduifb@gmx.de> - 2014-05-31 13:09 +0200
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Stefan Behnel <stefan_ml@behnel.de> - 2014-05-31 13:22 +0200
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Steve Hayes <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> - 2014-06-01 04:57 +0200
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-06-01 13:35 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2014-05-31 21:11 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Steve Hayes <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> - 2014-06-01 13:38 +0200
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Bob Martin <bob.martin@excite.com> - 2014-06-01 07:01 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-06-01 07:52 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Steve Hayes <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> - 2014-06-01 13:41 +0200
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-06-01 12:53 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python alister <alister.nospam.ware@ntlworld.com> - 2014-06-01 17:21 +0000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Bob Martin <bob.martin@excite.com> - 2014-06-02 07:14 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-05-31 12:30 +0000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python wxjmfauth@gmail.com - 2014-05-31 08:48 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> - 2014-06-02 09:01 -0600
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-06-02 16:15 +0000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Roy Smith <roy@panix.com> - 2014-06-02 12:21 -0400
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-06-03 02:30 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-06-02 16:52 +0000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Johannes Bauer <dfnsonfsduifb@gmx.de> - 2014-06-02 19:16 +0200
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> - 2014-06-02 11:53 -0600
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-06-02 18:59 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python wxjmfauth@gmail.com - 2014-06-02 23:12 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2014-06-02 23:30 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-06-03 09:03 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Ned Batchelder <ned@nedbatchelder.com> - 2014-06-03 07:22 -0400
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Michael Torrie <torriem@gmail.com> - 2014-07-14 21:58 -0600
Re: Python 3 is killing Python wxjmfauth@gmail.com - 2014-07-15 00:23 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-07-15 08:31 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Michael Torrie <torriem@gmail.com> - 2014-07-14 21:47 -0600
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-15 14:20 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Fabien <fabien.maussion@gmail.com> - 2014-07-15 14:17 +0200
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-15 23:00 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Kevin Walzer <kw@codebykevin.com> - 2014-07-15 09:57 -0400
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-16 00:31 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-07-15 20:38 +0300
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-07-15 19:06 +0000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-07-15 23:01 +0300
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-07-16 03:51 +0000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-16 14:20 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2014-07-16 07:33 +0000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-07-16 08:52 +0300
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-16 16:26 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-07-16 09:44 +0300
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-16 16:50 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python wxjmfauth@gmail.com - 2014-07-16 00:11 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2014-07-16 07:49 +0000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-16 18:44 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-07-16 11:35 +0000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-16 21:54 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-07-16 13:46 +0300
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-07-16 12:10 +0000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-16 22:55 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python wxjmfauth@gmail.com - 2014-07-16 06:10 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-07-16 16:11 +0300
Re: Python 3 is killing Python wxjmfauth@gmail.com - 2014-07-16 06:22 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-17 00:04 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-07-16 17:39 +0300
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-17 01:23 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-07-16 18:48 +0300
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-17 02:07 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-07-16 19:20 +0300
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2014-07-17 02:51 +0000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-17 13:15 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python MRAB <python@mrabarnett.plus.com> - 2014-07-17 12:27 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python "Frank Millman" <frank@chagford.com> - 2014-07-17 07:18 +0200
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2014-07-17 07:49 +0000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2014-07-30 14:31 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2014-07-16 17:02 -0400
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2014-07-16 18:47 -0400
Re: Python 3 is killing Python "Frank Millman" <frank@chagford.com> - 2014-07-16 16:27 +0200
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2014-07-16 15:41 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-07-17 00:00 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2014-07-16 18:16 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2014-07-17 03:14 +0000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-07-17 08:17 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python alex23 <wuwei23@gmail.com> - 2014-07-18 12:49 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Dan Stromberg <drsalists@gmail.com> - 2014-07-17 20:34 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2014-07-18 14:17 +0000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-17 13:20 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-07-17 23:54 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2014-07-17 03:16 +0000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2014-07-16 21:47 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Fabien <fabien.maussion@gmail.com> - 2014-07-17 12:12 +0200
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-17 21:12 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2014-07-17 11:15 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-18 04:27 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-07-17 21:44 +0300
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2014-07-17 19:24 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-18 12:39 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Michael Torrie <torriem@gmail.com> - 2014-07-17 21:40 -0600
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-07-18 08:24 +0300
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-07-18 08:34 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2014-07-18 14:19 +0000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Larry Martell <larry.martell@gmail.com> - 2014-07-18 08:35 -0600
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Torsten Bronger <bronger@physik.rwth-aachen.de> - 2014-07-18 17:25 +0200
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2014-07-18 19:45 -0400
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-07-17 20:06 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Emile van Sebille <emile@fenx.com> - 2014-07-17 12:22 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-07-17 21:37 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2014-07-17 17:30 -0400
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2014-07-17 20:13 -0400
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-07-18 18:38 +0000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-07-18 01:26 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python alex23 <wuwei23@gmail.com> - 2014-07-18 12:54 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Andrew Berg <aberg010@my.hennepintech.edu> - 2014-07-17 19:45 -0500
Re: Python 3 is killing Python alex23 <wuwei23@gmail.com> - 2014-07-18 13:01 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-07-18 16:45 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-18 12:15 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2014-07-17 20:37 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-18 15:34 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> - 2014-07-18 02:21 -0600
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-18 18:27 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python MRAB <python@mrabarnett.plus.com> - 2014-07-18 16:46 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-07-18 16:49 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-07-18 16:50 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-07-18 17:22 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2014-07-18 21:27 -0400
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2014-07-18 21:21 -0400
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2014-07-19 09:29 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-20 02:41 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> - 2014-07-19 12:00 -0600
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2014-07-19 13:39 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-20 09:13 +1000
Improving Idle (was Re: Python 3 ...) Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2014-07-19 16:45 -0400
Re: Improving Idle (was Re: Python 3 ...) Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2014-07-19 18:31 -0700
Re: Improving Idle (was Re: Python 3 ...) Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-20 11:42 +1000
Re: Improving Idle (was Re: Python 3 ...) Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-07-20 12:40 +0100
Idle's Shell: prompts and indents (was ...) Idle users please read Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2014-07-20 17:52 -0400
Re: Idle's Shell: prompts and indents (was ...) Idle users please read Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2014-07-20 18:22 -0700
Re: Idle's Shell: prompts and indents (was ...) Idle users please read Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-21 11:32 +1000
Re: Idle's Shell: prompts and indents (was ...) Idle users please read Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2014-07-20 23:49 -0400
Re: Idle's Shell: prompts and indents (was ...) Idle users please read Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-21 10:55 +1000
Re: Idle's Shell: prompts and indents (was ...) Idle users please read Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2014-07-20 23:28 -0400
Re: Idle's Shell: prompts and indents (was ...) Idle users please read Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-21 13:34 +1000
Re: Idle's Shell: prompts and indents (was ...) Idle users please read Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2014-07-21 05:00 -0400
Re: Idle's Shell: prompts and indents (was ...) Idle users please read wxjmfauth@gmail.com - 2014-07-21 13:00 -0700
Re: Idle's Shell: prompts and indents (was ...) Idle users please read Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-21 20:56 +1000
Re: Idle's Shell: prompts and indents (was ...) Idle users please read Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2014-07-21 14:30 -0400
Re: Idle's Shell: prompts and indents (was ...) Idle users please read Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-22 04:35 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2014-07-19 15:50 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2014-07-19 19:23 -0400
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-20 09:10 +1000
Re: Improving Idle (was Re: Python 3 ...) Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-07-21 02:54 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-07-18 08:24 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-07-18 18:20 +0000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-07-18 19:31 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python MRAB <python@mrabarnett.plus.com> - 2014-07-18 20:44 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2014-07-18 14:37 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Ned Batchelder <ned@nedbatchelder.com> - 2014-07-18 18:09 -0400
Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-07-19 07:28 +0000
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] "C.D. Reimer" <chris@cdreimer.com> - 2014-07-19 11:08 -0700
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2014-07-19 14:31 -0400
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-07-20 01:23 +0000
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-20 11:39 +1000
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] "C.D. Reimer" <chris@cdreimer.com> - 2014-07-19 18:53 -0700
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] CHIN Dihedral <dihedral88888@gmail.com> - 2014-07-21 08:37 -0700
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Tim Delaney <timothy.c.delaney@gmail.com> - 2014-07-20 14:18 +1000
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Tim Delaney <timothy.c.delaney@gmail.com> - 2014-07-20 07:50 +1000
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-20 09:19 +1000
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Tim Delaney <timothy.c.delaney@gmail.com> - 2014-07-20 10:41 +1000
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] "C.D. Reimer" <chris@cdreimer.com> - 2014-07-19 18:24 -0700
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] TP <wingusr@gmail.com> - 2014-07-19 19:03 -0700
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] "C.D. Reimer" <chris@cdreimer.com> - 2014-07-19 20:10 -0700
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Wolfgang Keller <feliphil@gmx.net> - 2014-08-01 13:10 +0200
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-08-01 21:22 +1000
Re: Python and IDEs Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-08-01 15:19 +0300
Re: Python and IDEs Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-08-01 22:30 +1000
Re: Python and IDEs Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-08-01 23:10 +1000
Re: Python and IDEs Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-08-01 23:30 +1000
Re: Python and IDEs Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-08-01 18:13 +0300
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Wolfgang Keller <feliphil@gmx.net> - 2014-08-06 14:38 +0200
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-08-06 22:51 +1000
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Wolfgang Keller <feliphil@gmx.net> - 2014-08-11 11:08 +0200
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Nicholas Cole <nicholas.cole@gmail.com> - 2014-08-01 15:28 +0100
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Wolfgang Keller <feliphil@gmx.net> - 2014-08-06 14:47 +0200
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-08-07 13:32 +1000
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Wolfgang Keller <feliphil@gmx.net> - 2014-08-11 11:08 +0200
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] alister <alister.nospam.ware@ntlworld.com> - 2014-08-11 09:37 +0000
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-08-11 20:20 +1000
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-08-11 14:45 +0100
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2014-08-11 18:42 +0000
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-08-12 10:11 +1000
Re: Quoting and attribution (was: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python]) Tim Chase <python.list@tim.thechases.com> - 2014-08-11 19:27 -0500
Re: Quoting and attribution (was: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python]) Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2014-08-12 02:07 +0000
Re: Quoting and attribution (was: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python]) Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-08-12 12:13 +1000
Re: Quoting and attribution (was: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python]) Tim Chase <python.list@tim.thechases.com> - 2014-08-11 21:23 -0500
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Wolfgang Keller <feliphil@gmx.net> - 2014-08-13 12:42 +0200
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-08-13 23:35 +1000
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-08-13 16:51 +0100
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-08-02 00:39 +1000
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Gregory Ewing <greg.ewing@canterbury.ac.nz> - 2014-08-02 11:14 +1200
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-08-02 09:50 +1000
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Olaf Hering <olaf@aepfle.de> - 2014-08-02 09:10 +0200
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Gregory Ewing <greg.ewing@canterbury.ac.nz> - 2014-08-02 23:38 +1200
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Dietmar Schwertberger <maillist@schwertberger.de> - 2014-08-01 19:16 +0200
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Wolfgang Keller <feliphil@gmx.net> - 2014-08-06 14:47 +0200
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2014-08-11 18:39 +0000
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Wolfgang Keller <feliphil@gmx.net> - 2014-08-13 13:46 +0200
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Michael Torrie <torriem@gmail.com> - 2014-08-01 14:22 -0600
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] MRAB <python@mrabarnett.plus.com> - 2014-08-01 22:09 +0100
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Gregory Ewing <greg.ewing@canterbury.ac.nz> - 2014-08-02 12:00 +1200
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-08-02 10:20 +1000
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Gregory Ewing <greg.ewing@canterbury.ac.nz> - 2014-08-02 23:33 +1200
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-08-02 23:01 +1000
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Gregory Ewing <greg.ewing@canterbury.ac.nz> - 2014-08-03 12:01 +1200
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-08-03 11:12 +1000
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] MRAB <python@mrabarnett.plus.com> - 2014-08-02 14:55 +0100
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Gregory Ewing <greg.ewing@canterbury.ac.nz> - 2014-08-03 12:04 +1200
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Dietmar Schwertberger <maillist@schwertberger.de> - 2014-08-03 09:46 +0200
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Roy Smith <roy@panix.com> - 2014-08-02 10:27 -0400
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Gregory Ewing <greg.ewing@canterbury.ac.nz> - 2014-08-03 12:20 +1200
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-08-02 09:48 +1000
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Duncan Booth <duncan.booth@invalid.invalid> - 2014-08-05 13:29 +0000
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-08-06 02:50 +1000
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] Duncan Booth <duncan.booth@invalid.invalid> - 2014-08-05 19:25 +0000
Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] TP <wingusr@gmail.com> - 2014-08-05 14:28 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2014-07-18 19:26 -0400
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Kevin Walzer <kw@codebykevin.com> - 2014-08-03 21:21 -0400
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-17 01:18 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Javier <nospam@nospam.com> - 2014-07-16 17:33 +0000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> - 2014-07-16 11:50 -0600
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2014-07-17 03:33 +0000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2014-07-17 04:25 +0000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python "Neil D. Cerutti" <neilc@norwich.edu> - 2014-07-16 11:48 -0400
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-07-16 18:34 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python "Frank Millman" <frank@chagford.com> - 2014-07-17 08:31 +0200
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-17 16:41 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python "Frank Millman" <frank@chagford.com> - 2014-07-17 09:09 +0200
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-17 17:59 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Glenn Linderman <v+python@g.nevcal.com> - 2014-08-01 23:18 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-07-15 21:24 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Devin Jeanpierre <jeanpierreda@gmail.com> - 2014-07-15 13:47 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Abhiram R <abhi.darkness@gmail.com> - 2014-07-16 03:07 +0530
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-07-16 02:08 +0000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Abhiram R <abhi.darkness@gmail.com> - 2014-07-16 03:05 +0530
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-07-15 22:49 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Abhiram R <abhi.darkness@gmail.com> - 2014-07-16 03:43 +0530
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Kevin Walzer <kw@codebykevin.com> - 2014-07-15 18:30 -0400
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Abhiram R <abhi.darkness@gmail.com> - 2014-07-16 04:10 +0530
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2014-07-15 16:53 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python MRAB <python@mrabarnett.plus.com> - 2014-07-16 02:57 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Tim Roberts <timr@probo.com> - 2014-07-16 20:20 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-17 13:38 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Abhiram R <abhi.darkness@gmail.com> - 2014-07-16 09:07 +0530
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-07-16 09:18 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris “Kwpolska” Warrick <kwpolska@gmail.com> - 2014-07-16 12:20 +0200
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Ben Finney <ben@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-07-17 14:17 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Joshua Landau <joshua@landau.ws> - 2014-07-16 00:45 +0100
Interleaved posting style for text discussion forums (was: Python 3 is killing Python) Ben Finney <ben@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-07-17 14:02 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-07-15 23:38 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Kevin Walzer <kw@codebykevin.com> - 2014-07-15 20:43 -0400
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Dennis Lee Bieber <wlfraed@ix.netcom.com> - 2014-07-15 23:05 -0400
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2014-07-16 13:59 +0000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2014-07-15 11:01 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-07-15 21:08 +0300
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-07-15 18:57 +0000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-07-15 22:49 +0300
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-07-15 18:53 +0000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2014-07-15 13:20 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> - 2014-07-15 14:46 -0600
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> - 2014-07-15 12:53 -0600
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Anders Wegge Keller <wegge@wegge.dk> - 2014-07-15 17:02 +0200
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2014-07-15 15:43 +0000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-07-15 16:44 +0100
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-16 01:48 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python alex23 <wuwei23@gmail.com> - 2014-07-17 15:48 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2014-07-17 07:03 +0000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2014-07-17 10:36 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-18 03:52 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2014-07-17 11:38 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-07-18 04:48 +1000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-07-18 18:01 +0000
Re: Python 3 is killing Python wxjmfauth@gmail.com - 2014-07-15 06:33 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Steve Hayes <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> - 2014-06-01 05:00 +0200
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-05-31 15:44 +0300
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Steve Hayes <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> - 2014-06-01 05:05 +0200
Re: Python 3 is killing Python pyotr filipivich <phamp@mindspring.com> - 2014-07-12 10:50 -0700
Re: Python 3 is killing Python Deb Wyatt <codemonkey@inbox.com> - 2014-05-31 09:28 -0800
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| From | Duncan Booth <duncan.booth@invalid.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-08-05 19:25 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] |
| Message-ID | <XnsA380CFBEE272Cduncanbooth@127.0.0.1> |
| In reply to | #75746 |
Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> wrote: > Duncan Booth wrote: > >> Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> wrote: >> >>> Unfortunately, software development on Windows is something of a >>> ghetto, compared to the wide range of free tools available for >>> Linux. > > I remember writing this. But I don't remember when it was. Presumably > some time in the last six months :-) > >>> Outside of a few oases like Microsoft's own commercial development >>> tools, it's hard to do development on Windows. Hard, but not >>> impossible, of course, and there are quite a few resources available >>> for the Windows user willing to download installers from the >>> Internet. For Python users, the IDEs from Wingware and Activestate >>> are notable: >>> >>> https://wingware.com/ >>> http://komodoide.com/ >>> >>> >>> >> I missed this thread when it started, so please forgive me if this >> has been covered, but by dismissing Microsoft you look to have >> skipped over a very powerful Python IDE for Windows, namely PTVS. > > Never heard of it :-) > > Which is not surprising, since I'm not a Windows developer. > > [snip feature list] > > Nice. How does one get it? 1) Get a Windows 8.1 VM, or a real PC if that's more convenient. 2) Download and install either "Microsoft Visual Studio Express 2013 with Update 3 for Web" or "Microsoft Visual Studio Express 2013 with Update 3 for Windows Desktop" from http://www.visualstudio.com/downloads/download-visual-studio-vs N.B. If you just download the original versions without update 3 you'll have to apply all updates before proceeding so easier to use the latest versions from the get go. 3) Download and install PTVS 2.1 Beta 2 from https://pytools.codeplex.com/releases Note that you need at least PTVS 2.1 Beta and VS Express 2013 with at least Update 2 to be able to install with just free tools. Earlier versions will refuse to install. There may be more intermediate steps of applying updates, but that's par for the Microsoft course. If you try this out in conjunction with a Microsoft Azure account then be sure to also install the Azure SDK. Documentation is at https://pytools.codeplex.com/documentation There's a Django tutorial at http://pytools.codeplex.com/wikipage? title=Django%20Web%20Site/Cloud%20Service%20Tutorial which gives quite a good walkthrough. > > If I gave the impression that one cannot do development on Windows, > that was not my intent. I tried to indicate that the difference was a > matter of degree, not impossibility. One of the reasons why so many of > the core developers for Python use Linux is that they got frustrated > with the speed humps on Windows, the poor "out of the box" experience > for developers (compare what dev tools you get with Windows by default > versus what you get on Linux by default), but that might also be > somewhat self-selecting: people who are happy with Windows development > tend to stick to VB, Java, C, .Net etc. while those who prefer lighter > weight more agile environments migrate to Linux. I don't know. > > But I do know that the existence of good quality Windows development > tools for Python is good news for the community, so thank you for > mentioning this. > So far they seem to have kept a pretty low profile; I suspect largely because until recently PTVS only worked with the pay versions of Visual Studio. -- Duncan Booth
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | TP <wingusr@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-08-05 14:28 -0700 |
| Subject | Re: Python and IDEs [was Re: Python 3 is killing Python] |
| Message-ID | <mailman.12676.1407274139.18130.python-list@python.org> |
| In reply to | #75748 |
[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw
On Tue, Aug 5, 2014 at 12:25 PM, Duncan Booth <duncan.booth@invalid.invalid> wrote: > So far they seem to have kept a pretty low profile; I suspect largely > because until recently PTVS only worked with the pay versions of Visual > Studio. > Not true. When it didn't work with the free express versions of VS, it worked with the free Visual Studio Shell (that people have also not heard about :) So there has always been some free way of running PTVS.
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-07-18 19:26 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <mailman.12024.1405726204.18130.python-list@python.org> |
| In reply to | #74663 |
On 7/17/2014 8:26 PM, Mark Lawrence wrote: > On 18/07/2014 01:13, Terry Reedy wrote: >> On 7/17/2014 2:15 PM, Rick Johnson wrote: >> a partial disinformation rant again Idle >> that repeats things said before, more than once. >> >> Still more facts ;-). About three (four?) years ago, you posted a >> similar rant. Being wise, I encouraged your participation and utilized >> the patch you anonymously posted on the tracker (to maintain your >> Ranting Rick pose) in one of my first commits. I invite you to resume >> your participation, either anonymously or openly. As before, you can >> email me privately to discuss what would best suite you and also be >> helpful. >> > > I'm looking forward to see the massive number of fixes that come from > rr, assuming of course that he signs the CLA to make this possible. Or > has he already done so? I don't remember the alias to check. -- Terry Jan Reedy
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Kevin Walzer <kw@codebykevin.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-08-03 21:21 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <lrmn6m$nc1$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #74663 |
RIck, On 7/17/14, 2:15 PM, Rick Johnson wrote: > Sadly, all of my calls to improve IDLE have been meet with > rebukes about me "whining". The "powers that be" would wise > to*UTILIZE* and*ENCOURAGE* my participation instead of > *IGNORING* valuable talent and*IMPEDING* the expansion of > this "private boys club". A bit late to this, I suppose... Where are your patches? Can you point me to anywhere at the Python bug tracker where they can be found? I'll highlight the two major patches I've submitted over the past few years: http://bugs.python.org/issue15853 http://bugs.python.org/issue6075 One fixed a pretty bad crash on the Mac, and the other optimized IDLE's Mac port to adjust to some API changes in Tk because of a switch in the native back end (Carbon to Cocoa). In both cases I posted an e-mail or two to the relevant mailing list (IDLE-dev and MacPython) to provide a head-up about the patch, answer questions, and so on--but that was it. No major "calls to improve IDLE," just some code that DID improve IDLE. The "powers that be" didn't commit the patches right away, and not without some modification and testing, but they eventually did commit them, and the outcome satisfied my intention in submitting the patches in the first place. Both of these patches addressed issues that made IDLE pretty much un-usable for me. Obviously a crash will do this, but also, when I switched my installation of Tk from the Carbon-backed one to the Cocoa-backed one, there were lots of little glitches because of subtle differences in how Cocoa did things. I suppose I simply could have filled the mailing lists with complaints that these things were Big Problems for me and Someone Should Do Something About Them, but there was no guarantee that someone would pick up the challenge. Fortunately, I had the knowledge, skills and time to submit patches that were sufficiently developed that the relevant Python maintainers could take them, apply them, modify slightly as required, test them, and then commit them. This did ensure that Something Would Be Done about my issue, because the Person Who Did Something About It was me. I know you are proficient in both Python and Tkinter, as I've noted from the helpful advice you give Tkinter newbies on the list from time to time, and so I'm sure you have the skill set to put together some patches that address specific points of pain for you. And despite the disagreement that others may register with you in these threads from time to time, I'm quite confident that useful patches will be gratefully accepted, even if not immediately. --Kevin -- Kevin Walzer Code by Kevin/Mobile Code by Kevin http://www.codebykevin.com http://www.wtmobilesoftware.com
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-07-17 01:18 +1000 |
| Message-ID | <mailman.11882.1405523943.18130.python-list@python.org> |
| In reply to | #74533 |
On Thu, Jul 17, 2014 at 12:27 AM, Frank Millman <frank@chagford.com> wrote:
> FWIW, here are my thoughts -
>
> 1. There were many backward-incompatible changes made in Python3, but the
> only one that seems to cause problems is the change to the bytes/str types.
> I agree that it is a big change, but the others seem to have been accepted
> without argument, so it seems to me that the python devs got an awful lot
> right.
There are quite a few changes that are almost completely
insignificant, like renaming (eg Tkinter to tkinter), where there's
this tiny difference at the top of your program and absolutely no
difference elsewhere. And there are a few where, for instance,
FileNotFoundError was created, as a subclass of OSError; I have a
program that needs to catch that exception, and I just have a trap at
the top that, if there's no FNFE, assigns it equal to OSError, and
then proceeds as normal. (This does mean that, under Python 2, the
mini HTTP server returns 404s for other types of OSError attempting to
read from certain files; under Python 3, those will result in 500s and
logged errors. I'm not overly concerned about that difference, but I
prefer the Py3 behaviour.) These sorts of changes, while technically
backward-incompatible, aren't going to cause argument - you just zip
through your code and change stuff (probably with a script like 2to3),
or else add a bit of header to ensure compatibility with both
versions. Pretty easy.
Then there are the changes that, while again technically
backward-incompatible, are practically identical *in normal usage*.
For instance, range no longer returns a list, but most range usage is
with iteration anyway. Dict views rather than lists might cause some
problems (if you iterate over d.keys() while mutating d, you'll have
problems in Py3, but in Py2 it's fine), but again, any place where you
have issues, you just tweak it to the new recommended style. Several
of these changes are actually less significant than one change that
happened within the 2.x line - the change from string exceptions to
subclasses of (Base)Exception. There have been a few complaints, but
they're not the stuff about which people say "Python 3 is killing
Python".
> 2. Those adversely affected by the change are very vocal, but we hear very
> little from those who have benefited from it. This is to be expected - they
> are just getting on with developing in Python3 and have no need to get
> involved in controversies.
That's very true. Sometimes you get an idea of how silent something is
and therefore how successful; for example, my house has been
progressively migrated almost exclusively to Linux, and the days that
go by without anyone asking me for help are proof that Linux is a
perfectly acceptable desktop OS. (Actually, even when people _do_ ask
me for help, it's usually either something to do with git, or
something advanced like "How can I find out which files in this whole
directory tree have been changed recently?", which your average user
wouldn't know off-hand how to do on Windows or OS/2 either.) Python 3
has served many people just fine, and those people aren't writing blog
posts about how unexciting their lives have become now that they don't
have to deal with bug reports about stuff the language just does for
them.
> I just tried an experiment in my own project. Ned Batchelder, in his
> Pragmatic Unicode presentation, http://nedbatchelder.com/text/unipain.html,
> suggests that you always have some unicode characters in your data, just to
> ensure that they are handled correctly. He has a tongue-in-cheek example
> which spells the word PYTHON using various exotic unicode characters. I used
> this to populate a field in my database, to see if it would display in my
> browser-based client.
>
> The hardest part was getting it in. There are 6 characters, but utf-8
> requires 16 bytes to store it -
>
> b'\xe2\x84\x99\xc6\xb4\xe2\x98\x82\xe2\x84\x8c\xc3\xb8\xe1\xbc\xa4'.decode('utf-8')
>
Ideally, you would have a browser-based input system as well, which
would allow you to do the whole thing directly. Also, I would strongly
recommend using a database back-end that stores Unicode; and if that
back-end is MySQL, be aware that "utf8" is actually a messed-up
encoding that's like UTF-8 only restricted to three bytes (and
therefore the BMP), and you have to use "utf8mb4" to store all of
Unicode. With a decent back-end like PostgreSQL, you can do this sort
of thing directly:
rosuav=> create table test (id serial primary key,txt text);
CREATE TABLE
rosuav=> insert into test (txt) values ('U+1234 is ሴ');
INSERT 0 1
rosuav=> insert into test (txt) values ('U+12345 is 𒍅');
INSERT 0 1
rosuav=> select id,txt,length(txt) from test;
id | txt | length
----+--------------+--------
1 | U+1234 is ሴ | 11
2 | U+12345 is 𒍅 | 12
(2 rows)
Looks fine to me. You should be able to read and write Unicode from Python, too.
> However, that was it. Without any changes to my program, it read it from the
> database and displayed it on the screen. IE8 could only display 2 out of the
> 6 characters correctly, and Chrome could display 5 out of 6, but that is a
> separate issue. Python3 handled it perfectly.
That's more of a font issue than anything else. I played around with
U+12345 in the above example, and it didn't display usefully in either
my console or Chrome here, but it's still obviously there as a single
character.
> Would this have been so easy using Python2 - I don't think so.
If all you ever do is read stuff from one place and write it to
another, it doesn't make a lot of difference whether you're working
with Unicode text or UTF-8 bytes. The trouble comes when you want to
take the length of it, trim it, or anything like that; for instance,
suppose you want to have a preview of the text, ellipsizing if the
full text is longer than (say) 30 characters, with the full text
available by clicking or hovering the mouse or something. At that
point, UTF-8 becomes a dashed nuisance, and true Unicode support makes
it a breeze.
> What follows
> is blatant speculation, but it is quite possible that there are many
> non-English speakers out there that have had their lives made much easier by
> the changes to Python3 - a 'silent majority'? I don't mean an absolute
> majority, as I believe there are still more Python2 users than Python3. But
> of those who have made the switch from 2 to 3, maybe most of them are quite
> happy. If so, then the python devs got that right as well.
It's impossible to say how many Py2 users there are and how many Py3.
But I would say that there are a HUGE number of people who've either
written Py3 code brand new, or ported something from Py2, and had no
significant trouble.
> Unfortunately, human nature being what it is, the possibility of this split
> in the community continuing, to the detriment of Python itself, is all too
> real. I don't know what more the python devs can do, but there are no
> guarantees of success :-(
What split, exactly? There are always these talks of a split... but I
don't see one happening. I don't see, for instance,
python2-list@python.org or comp.lang.python2 being separated out. I
don't see Linux distributions choosing to support only one branch and
not the other (only one can be the default and the system Python, but
the other is usually just an apt-get/yum/pacman away). I don't see
anyone taking the Python 2 source code and backporting a bunch of
Python 3 features (and/or adding a bunch of their own features) and
creating the Python 2.8 that http://blog.startifact.com/guido_no.jpg
rejects. What split is actually occurring, or going to occur? I think
anyone who talks of splitting has an unrealistically low idea of the
costs of such a split; moving away from what the core Python devs are
doing means setting up everything fresh, and it's just way too much
work to do that.
I don't know what's going to happen in 2020, though. There might be a
split between three communities: the Python 3 community, the Red Hat
supported Python 2 community, and the ActiveState supported Python 2
community. Or maybe there'll be some other commercial support. Or
maybe there'll still be some measure of community support for Python 2
here on python-list and other such places, and there won't be a split
even then. (People have come here talking about Python 1.5, although
there isn't a huge amount of support for that anywhere!) Frankly, the
Python devs need do nothing and can do nothing; the mass of users will
go where it goes, 800lb gorilla style, and it's up to them to either
find their own bananas or join the python.org banana plantation. One
way or another, it'll work out.
ChrisA
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| From | Javier <nospam@nospam.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-07-16 17:33 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <lq6d1o$1q9$1@speranza.aioe.org> |
| In reply to | #74561 |
> I don't see anyone taking the Python 2 source code and backporting a > bunch of Python 3 features (and/or adding a bunch of their own > features) and creating the Python 2.8 that > http://blog.startifact.com/guido_no.jpg rejects. What split is > actually occurring, or going to occur? I think anyone who talks of > splitting has an unrealistically low idea of the costs of such a > split; moving away from what the core Python devs are doing means > setting up everything fresh, and it's just way too much work to do > that. Up to now there have been no attemps of forking because python2.x was still being developed and they even ported some of the features of python3 to 2.6/2.7. I think there has been a severe miscalculation, and the change in the name of the interpreter python3 to python http://legacy.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0394/ is a good example of the disconnection between GvR and the real world. Arch Linux was the only distro to fall in the trap, and those who use it (as myself) need to put fake executables in /usr/local/bin for everything: (python, sphinx, virtualenv...) selecting 2 or 3 http://sindhus.bitbucket.org/manage-python-2-3.html Things are a bit more complex than just changing '#!/usr/bin/env python' to '#!/usr/bin/env python2' Let's see what it happens now that no more features are added to 2.x. 2.8 fork anybody?
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| From | Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-07-16 11:50 -0600 |
| Message-ID | <mailman.11892.1405533074.18130.python-list@python.org> |
| In reply to | #74572 |
On Wed, Jul 16, 2014 at 11:33 AM, Javier <nospam@nospam.com> wrote: > I think there has been a severe miscalculation, and the change in the > name of the interpreter python3 to python > http://legacy.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0394/ is a good example of the > disconnection between GvR and the real world. Er, that PEP currently recommends that python be a symlink to python2. It states that at some point in the future, the recommendation will change to have python symlink to python3. > Arch Linux was the only distro to fall in the trap You've got the order of events backward. That PEP was created *because* Arch decided to link python to python3. Neither GvR nor anybody else who work on Python have any control over that.
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| From | Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-07-17 03:33 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <53c743f7$0$29897$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> |
| In reply to | #74575 |
On Wed, 16 Jul 2014 11:50:24 -0600, Ian Kelly wrote: > On Wed, Jul 16, 2014 at 11:33 AM, Javier <nospam@nospam.com> wrote: >> I think there has been a severe miscalculation, and the change in the >> name of the interpreter python3 to python >> http://legacy.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0394/ is a good example of the >> disconnection between GvR and the real world. > > Er, that PEP currently recommends that python be a symlink to python2. > It states that at some point in the future, the recommendation will > change to have python symlink to python3. > >> Arch Linux was the only distro to fall in the trap > > You've got the order of events backward. That PEP was created *because* > Arch decided to link python to python3. Neither GvR nor anybody else > who work on Python have any control over that. This is correct. When Arch first announced this change, oh, four years ago if I remember correctly, the core devs were rather dismayed. Some of them would prefer to see "python" mean "python2" forever (which I happen to disagree with) but even those who would like to see "python" some day mean "python3" thought it was *way* too early. I think that the sensible approach is to start by migrating internal tools to "python2" rather than "python", then migrate internal tools to python3, and gradually move towards having "python" mean "the user's python" rather than "the system python". That will be future-proof for Python 4 and Python 5. -- Steven
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| From | Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-07-17 04:25 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <53c7501d$0$29897$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> |
| In reply to | #74572 |
On Wed, 16 Jul 2014 17:33:44 +0000, Javier wrote: > 2.8 fork anybody? It already exists. It is called 2.7, and 2.6 before that. Python 3.0 came out on December 3rd, 2008, a couple of weeks before the last release of 2.4 and in parallel with 2.5 (2.4.6 and 2.5.3 both came out on the 19th December). 2.6 and 2.7 are the transitional versions between 2.x and 3.x. The core devs deliberately set out to have a long (10 years or more) transition period. Early adaptors can help iron out the issues with Python 3.0, 3.1 and 3.2, 3.3 starts going mainstream, and it won't be until probably 3.5 or 3.6 that Python 3 will be truly mainstream. If you're still using Python 2.7 when Python 3.7 comes out in (likely 4 or 5 years), you'll be in the same position as those who are still using Python 2.2 or 2.3 now: you'll either be happy with the status quo (and lack of external support) and will never change, or you've missed the boat. -- Steven
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| From | "Neil D. Cerutti" <neilc@norwich.edu> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-07-16 11:48 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <mailman.11884.1405525719.18130.python-list@python.org> |
| In reply to | #74533 |
On 7/16/2014 10:27 AM, Frank Millman wrote: > Would this have been so easy using Python2 - I don't think so. What follows > is blatant speculation, but it is quite possible that there are many > non-English speakers out there that have had their lives made much easier by > the changes to Python3 - a 'silent majority'? I don't mean an absolute > majority, as I believe there are still more Python2 users than Python3. But > of those who have made the switch from 2 to 3, maybe most of them are quite > happy. If so, then the python devs got that right as well. Python3 has helped me cope with unexpected non-ASCII characters in other systems on our university campus while using a program written back before I knew anything about unicode. When I first spotted mojibake appearing in a student's name and address, it was only a couple of emails and a little investigation to determine which encoding= bits to sprinkle into my program. And I was finished. I wrote these applications a decade ago in Python2, and never worried about unicode. I translated them to Python3 years ago, and still never worried about unicode. The database is supposed to be sanitized against non-ASCII by an address and name-scrubbing application, which we aspend large amounts of cash on (I don't understand why, but that's what we do). And thanks to Python3, even though "illegal" characters have crept in, and even though I had never worried about unicode before, I could fix my program(s) the instant I knew which encodings to use. It would have been much harder to get right using Python2. -- Neil Cerutti
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| From | Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-07-16 18:34 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <mailman.11890.1405532099.18130.python-list@python.org> |
| In reply to | #74533 |
On 16/07/2014 15:27, Frank Millman wrote: > > This sub-thread is the most constructive one I have seen yet that deals with > the 'problems' that Python3 has created, and how to deal with them. > How many of the Python3 'problems' were backported to 2.7 or even 2.6? -- My fellow Pythonistas, ask not what our language can do for you, ask what you can do for our language. Mark Lawrence --- This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active. http://www.avast.com
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| From | "Frank Millman" <frank@chagford.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-07-17 08:31 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <mailman.11918.1405578686.18130.python-list@python.org> |
| In reply to | #74533 |
"Chris Angelico" <rosuav@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:CAPTjJmr4nPA6euD-j2uNAN==h=iDs1o5BDHGJ0FnjKJO9WfLXg@mail.gmail.com...
> On Thu, Jul 17, 2014 at 12:27 AM, Frank Millman <frank@chagford.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Unfortunately, human nature being what it is, the possibility of this
>> split
>> in the community continuing, to the detriment of Python itself, is all
>> too
>> real.
>
> What split, exactly? There are always these talks of a split... but I
> don't see one happening.
It is worth watching this -
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=skYBOXE02OQ
This is the intro -
Kenneth Reitz, Python evangelist at Heroku and author of the popular
Requests library, discusses the state of Python today, the division in the
community, and how we can forge ahead into a shiny future. Pythonistas
unite!
Frank
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| From | Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-07-17 16:41 +1000 |
| Message-ID | <mailman.11919.1405579280.18130.python-list@python.org> |
| In reply to | #74533 |
On Thu, Jul 17, 2014 at 4:31 PM, Frank Millman <frank@chagford.com> wrote: > It is worth watching this - > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=skYBOXE02OQ Not in a position to watch Youtube vids at the moment. A blog post I'd read, but a talk is not well suited to all forms of delivery... What's it saying, can you summarize? ChrisA
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| From | "Frank Millman" <frank@chagford.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-07-17 09:09 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <mailman.11920.1405581013.18130.python-list@python.org> |
| In reply to | #74533 |
"Chris Angelico" <rosuav@gmail.com> wrote in message news:CAPTjJmoT9q2CUYy5JC6kEYCxyp8_uSjHR1y8E+Z+T70QNc54xQ@mail.gmail.com... > On Thu, Jul 17, 2014 at 4:31 PM, Frank Millman <frank@chagford.com> wrote: >> It is worth watching this - >> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=skYBOXE02OQ > > Not in a position to watch Youtube vids at the moment. A blog post I'd > read, but a talk is not well suited to all forms of delivery... What's > it saying, can you summarize? I an also not in a position to watch it at the moment, but from memory ... The talk is recent - the video is dated 1st July 2014. He quotes some stats from PyPi, which shows number of downloads over a period, broken down by version. Over a recent period, Python2 downloads exceed Python3 downloads by a factor of 10:1 (subject to my memory ...) He has talked to many influential pythonistas in the recent past. He particularly comments on discussions with one of the prominent Python3 dissenters - Armin [can't remenber his surname]. He senses a great inertia in the established python community towards adopting Python3. He goes through some of the familiar reasons, most, if not all, relating to bytes/unicode. He is concerned about a growing division in the community, not only between users of the two versions, but between the mainstream users many of whom are resisting the move to Python3, and the developers, who are committed to Python3 but can only improve it by getting feedback from users. His closing plea was for users to get involved with Python3, help to improve it, and thereby help to re-unite the Python community. Frank P.S. If anyone watches the video, feel free to chip in and add to/correct what I have written above.
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| From | Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-07-17 17:59 +1000 |
| Message-ID | <mailman.11922.1405584329.18130.python-list@python.org> |
| In reply to | #74533 |
On Thu, Jul 17, 2014 at 5:09 PM, Frank Millman <frank@chagford.com> wrote: > He quotes some stats from PyPi, which shows number of downloads over a > period, broken down by version. Over a recent period, Python2 downloads > exceed Python3 downloads by a factor of 10:1 (subject to my memory ...) These kinds of stats are always flawed. In a lot of cases, they're skewed heavily by defaults, and in other cases, skewed even more heavily by long dependency trees - so, for instance, a single Django installation might involve fetching large numbers of packages from PyPI, even though no new code has been written at all. Might add quite a bit to the download stats for one version or the other. And what about upgrades? Stable installations are still likely to want to get the latest, which means downloading from PyPI, ergo it's another hit. ChrisA
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| From | Glenn Linderman <v+python@g.nevcal.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-08-01 23:18 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <mailman.12534.1406960354.18130.python-list@python.org> |
| In reply to | #74533 |
[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw
On 7/16/2014 7:27 AM, Frank Millman wrote:
> I just tried an experiment in my own project. Ned Batchelder, in his
> Pragmatic Unicode presentation, http://nedbatchelder.com/text/unipain.html,
> suggests that you always have some unicode characters in your data, just to
> ensure that they are handled correctly. He has a tongue-in-cheek example
> which spells the word PYTHON using various exotic unicode characters. I used
> this to populate a field in my database, to see if it would display in my
> browser-based client.
>
> The hardest part was getting it in. There are 6 characters, but utf-8
> requires 16 bytes to store it -
>
> b'\xe2\x84\x99\xc6\xb4\xe2\x98\x82\xe2\x84\x8c\xc3\xb8\xe1\xbc\xa4'.decode('utf-8')
>
> However, that was it. Without any changes to my program, it read it from the
> database and displayed it on the screen. IE8 could only display 2 out of the
> 6 characters correctly, and Chrome could display 5 out of 6, but that is a
> separate issue. Python3 handled it perfectly.
wrapping the above in a print(), on Windows, I get:
Traceback (most recent call last):
File "D:\my\py\python-utf8.py", line 1, in <module>
print(b'\xe2\x84\x99\xc6\xb4\xe2\x98\x82\xe2\x84\x8c\xc3\xb8\xe1\xbc\xa4'.decode('utf-8'))
File "C:\Python33\lib\encodings\cp437.py", line 19, in encode
return codecs.charmap_encode(input,self.errors,encoding_map)[0]
UnicodeEncodeError: 'charmap' codec can't encode characters in position
0-5: character maps to <undefined>
So Python3 doesn't handle it perfectly on Windows. And I saw someone
blame the Windows console for that... but the Windows console can
properly display all those characters if the proper APIs are used. The
bug is 7 years old: http://bugs.python.org/issue1602 and hasn't been
fixed, although the technology for fixing it is available, and various
workarounds (with limitations) have been available for 5 years, and
patches have been available for 3 years that work pretty good. However,
just a few days ago, 26 July 2014, Drekin had an insight that may
possibly lead to a patch that will work well enough to be integrated
into some future version of Python... I hope he follows up on it. This
is a serious limitation, and it is, and always has been, a bug in Python
3 Unicode handling on Windows.
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| From | Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-07-15 21:24 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <mailman.11847.1405455864.18130.python-list@python.org> |
| In reply to | #74494 |
On 15/07/2014 18:38, Marko Rauhamaa wrote: > Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com>: > >> Fine. Tell me how you would go about adding true Unicode support to >> Python 2.7, while still having it able to import an unchanged program. >> Trick question - it's fundamentally impossible, because an unchanged >> program will not distinguish between bytes and text, but true Unicode >> support requires that they be distinguished. > > Python 2 has always had unicode strings and [byte] strings. They were > always clearly distinguished. You really didn't have to change anything > for "true Unicode support". > That is the funniest tongue in cheek comment I've read in the 10+ years I''ve been hanging around here. It was tongue in cheek, wasn't it? -- My fellow Pythonistas, ask not what our language can do for you, ask what you can do for our language. Mark Lawrence --- This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active. http://www.avast.com
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| From | Devin Jeanpierre <jeanpierreda@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-07-15 13:47 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <mailman.11849.1405457292.18130.python-list@python.org> |
| In reply to | #74494 |
On Tue, Jul 15, 2014 at 1:24 PM, Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> wrote: > On 15/07/2014 18:38, Marko Rauhamaa wrote: >> >> Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com>: >> >>> Fine. Tell me how you would go about adding true Unicode support to >>> Python 2.7, while still having it able to import an unchanged program. >>> Trick question - it's fundamentally impossible, because an unchanged >>> program will not distinguish between bytes and text, but true Unicode >>> support requires that they be distinguished. >> >> >> Python 2 has always had unicode strings and [byte] strings. They were >> always clearly distinguished. You really didn't have to change anything >> for "true Unicode support". >> > > That is the funniest tongue in cheek comment I've read in the 10+ years > I''ve been hanging around here. It was tongue in cheek, wasn't it? What isn't "true" about Python 2.x's unicode support? The only feature I ever missed was case folding. (Not that 3.x does much better at that... :) The stdlib had poor unicode support, if that's what you mean. That could've been fixed without introducing backwards-incompatible changes, though. -- Devin
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| From | Abhiram R <abhi.darkness@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-07-16 03:07 +0530 |
| Message-ID | <mailman.11850.1405460291.18130.python-list@python.org> |
| In reply to | #74494 |
[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw
Annd I just saw that the lifetime has been pushed up to 2020 :) #SelfCorrected On Wed, Jul 16, 2014 at 3:05 AM, Abhiram R <abhi.darkness@gmail.com> wrote: > Umm..Guido Van Rossum said in Pycon 2014 that Py 2.x would be supported > only until 2015 :-| So...you know.. you have like an year before you *do *have > to migrate to 3.x . > > > On Wed, Jul 16, 2014 at 2:17 AM, Devin Jeanpierre <jeanpierreda@gmail.com> > wrote: > >> On Tue, Jul 15, 2014 at 1:24 PM, Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> >> wrote: >> > On 15/07/2014 18:38, Marko Rauhamaa wrote: >> >> >> >> Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com>: >> >> >> >>> Fine. Tell me how you would go about adding true Unicode support to >> >>> Python 2.7, while still having it able to import an unchanged program. >> >>> Trick question - it's fundamentally impossible, because an unchanged >> >>> program will not distinguish between bytes and text, but true Unicode >> >>> support requires that they be distinguished. >> >> >> >> >> >> Python 2 has always had unicode strings and [byte] strings. They were >> >> always clearly distinguished. You really didn't have to change anything >> >> for "true Unicode support". >> >> >> > >> > That is the funniest tongue in cheek comment I've read in the 10+ years >> > I''ve been hanging around here. It was tongue in cheek, wasn't it? >> >> What isn't "true" about Python 2.x's unicode support? The only feature >> I ever missed was case folding. (Not that 3.x does much better at that... >> :) >> >> The stdlib had poor unicode support, if that's what you mean. That >> could've been fixed without introducing backwards-incompatible >> changes, though. >> >> -- Devin >> -- >> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list >> > > > > -- > Abhiram.R > M.Tech CSE (Sem 3) > RVCE > Bangalore > -- Abhiram.R M.Tech CSE (Sem 3) RVCE Bangalore
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| From | Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-07-16 02:08 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <53c5de94$0$9505$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> |
| In reply to | #74509 |
On Wed, 16 Jul 2014 03:07:23 +0530, Abhiram R wrote about Python 2.7: > Annd I just saw that the lifetime has been pushed up to 2020 :) > #SelfCorrected Even when free support runs out, commercial support will be available. Red Hat is already committed to supporting Python 2.7 until 2023, and if there really is demand, nothing stops people or companies supporting it for the next 30 years. -- Steven
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