Path: csiph.com!newsfeed.hal-mli.net!feeder3.hal-mli.net!newsfeed.hal-mli.net!feeder1.hal-mli.net!newsfeed.xs4all.nl!newsfeed2.news.xs4all.nl!xs4all!newsgate.cistron.nl!newsgate.news.xs4all.nl!post.news.xs4all.nl!not-for-mail Return-Path: X-Original-To: python-list@python.org Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org X-Spam-Status: OK 0.004 X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 0.99; '*S*': 0.00; 'python.': 0.02; 'argument': 0.05; 'inspired': 0.05; 'exists.': 0.07; 'method,': 0.09; 'received:80.91': 0.09; 'received:80.91.229': 0.09; 'received:gmane.org': 0.09; 'received:list': 0.09; 'wrote': 0.14; 'callable': 0.16; 'contributors': 0.16; 'defaultdict': 0.16; 'dict': 0.16; 'received:80.91.229.3': 0.16; 'received:plane.gmane.org': 0.16; 'setdefault': 0.16; 'skip:n 70': 0.16; 'subclass': 0.16; 'subject:dictionaries': 0.16; 'wrote:': 0.18; 'seems': 0.21; 'appears': 0.22; 'separate': 0.22; 'exists': 0.24; 'earlier': 0.24; 'second': 0.26; 'header:X-Complaints-To:1': 0.27; 'function': 0.29; 'am,': 0.29; "doesn't": 0.30; 'primarily': 0.30; 'work.': 0.31; "skip:' 10": 0.31; 'idea,': 0.31; 'overhead': 0.31; 'values.': 0.31; 'probably': 0.32; 'cases': 0.33; 'skip:_ 10': 0.34; 'subject:with': 0.35; "can't": 0.35; 'but': 0.35; 'building': 0.35; 'there': 0.35; 'doing': 0.36; 'method': 0.36; 'easily': 0.37; 'sometimes': 0.38; 'initially': 0.38; 'to:addr :python-list': 0.38; 'delete': 0.39; 'to:addr:python.org': 0.39; 'received:org': 0.40; 'even': 0.60; 'up,': 0.60; 'no.': 0.61; "you're": 0.61; 'situation': 0.65; 'here': 0.66; 'frank': 0.68; 'default': 0.69; 'behavior': 0.77; 'dict()': 0.84; 'dict,': 0.84; 'ugly,': 0.84; 'either:': 0.91; 'dirty': 0.93 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ To: python-list@python.org From: "Frank Millman" Subject: Re: Keeping track of things with dictionaries Date: Tue, 8 Apr 2014 10:31:28 +0200 References: <534105ce$0$1365$4fafbaef@reader1.news.tin.it> <21ef5159-ad95-4d43-a2d6-7ecda941d978@googlegroups.com> X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: 197.87.50.147 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.3790.4657 X-RFC2646: Format=Flowed; Original X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.3790.4913 X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Newsgroups: comp.lang.python Message-ID: Lines: 46 NNTP-Posting-Host: 2001:888:2000:d::a6 X-Trace: 1396945907 news.xs4all.nl 2957 [2001:888:2000:d::a6]:39679 X-Complaints-To: abuse@xs4all.nl Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.python:69846 "Ian Kelly" wrote in message news:CALwzidmP5Bevbace9GyQrVXe-_2T=jtPQ1yVaPsAePvOMQePLA@mail.gmail.com... > On Tue, Apr 8, 2014 at 1:14 AM, Frank Millman wrote: >> >> It appears that when you use 'setdefault', the default is always >> evaluated, >> even if the key exists. >> >> It seems odd. Is there a situation where this behaviour is useful? > > No. The default argument is evaluated because it must be evaluated > before it can be passed into the method, just like any other function > argument in Python. So why doesn't it take a callable instead of a > value for its second argument? At a guess, because the method was > probably added for efficiency, and the function call overhead might > easily be slower than just doing a separate getitem and setitem. > > The reason setdefault exists I think is primarily because it was added > before defaultdict. The contributors at SO can't seem to come up with > any particularly good use cases either: > > http://stackoverflow.com/questions/3483520/use-cases-for-the-setdefault-dict-method > > One thing I will note as a disadvantage of defaultdict is that > sometimes you only want the default value behavior while you're > initially building the dict, and then you just want a normal dict with > KeyErrors from then on. defaultdict doesn't do that; once > constructed, it will always be a defaultdict. You can copy the data > into a normal dict using the dict() constructor, but this feels dirty > to me. Here is an idea, inspired by Peter Otten's suggestion earlier in this thread. Instead of defaultdict, subclass dict and use __missing__() to supply the default values. When the dictionary is set up, delete __missing__ from the subclass! Ugly, but it seems to work. Frank