Path: csiph.com!newsfeed.hal-mli.net!feeder3.hal-mli.net!newsfeed.hal-mli.net!feeder1.hal-mli.net!newsfeed.xs4all.nl!newsfeed2.news.xs4all.nl!xs4all!post.news.xs4all.nl!not-for-mail Return-Path: X-Original-To: python-list@python.org Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org X-Spam-Status: OK 0.012 X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 0.98; '*S*': 0.00; 'assign': 0.07; 'bash': 0.07; 'any.': 0.09; 'app,': 0.09; 'subject:still': 0.09; 'windows,': 0.09; 'subject:python': 0.11; 'chrome,': 0.16; 'decent': 0.16; 'desktop.': 0.16; 'development?': 0.16; 'finney': 0.16; 'from:addr:rosuav': 0.16; 'from:name:chris angelico': 0.16; 'greatness': 0.16; 'similar),': 0.16; 'ssh': 0.16; 'twenty': 0.16; 'wow,': 0.16; 'wrote:': 0.17; 'subject:need': 0.17; 'tend': 0.17; 'jan': 0.18; 'shell': 0.18; 'windows': 0.19; 'fine,': 0.22; 'lets': 0.22; 'required.': 0.22; 'programming': 0.23; "i've": 0.23; 'seems': 0.23; 'random': 0.24; 'command': 0.24; 'header:In- Reply-To:1': 0.25; '(most': 0.27; '(such': 0.27; 'message- id:@mail.gmail.com': 0.27; 'writes:': 0.29; 'probably': 0.29; "i'm": 0.29; 'related': 0.30; 'usually': 0.30; 'fri,': 0.30; 'primary': 0.30; 'running': 0.32; 'curious': 0.33; 'instances': 0.33; 'ubuntu': 0.33; 'to:addr:python-list': 0.33; 'received:google.com': 0.34; 'text': 0.34; 'project': 0.34; 'ben': 0.35; 'especially': 0.35; 'doing': 0.35; 'pm,': 0.35; 'received:209.85.220': 0.35; 'subject:?': 0.35; 'received:209.85': 0.35; 'add': 0.36; 'but': 0.36; 'editor': 0.37; 'two': 0.37; 'being': 0.37; 'subject:New': 0.37; 'systems,': 0.37; 'received:209': 0.37; 'subject:: ': 0.38; 'some': 0.38; 'things': 0.38; 'several': 0.39; 'to:addr:python.org': 0.39; 'google': 0.39; 'header:Received:5': 0.40; 'most': 0.61; 'subject:, ': 0.61; 'personally': 0.61; 'first': 0.61; 'kind': 0.61; "you'll": 0.62; 'different': 0.63; 'more': 0.63; 'charset:windows-1252': 0.65; 'offer': 0.65; 'else.': 0.65; 'gotten': 0.75; '2013': 0.84; 'century': 0.84; 'hugely': 0.84; 'running,': 0.84; 'subject:good': 0.84; 'windows)': 0.84; 'relating': 0.93 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=02qYfOsX43voSeyYHYrUwss0CNdLQF+ILFjM83gJiTw=; b=X03iZptvhKHdf8MZSJQ/9kwrPaXpvUCjEGvJ7cm1jAhDx/tCCbEqIDY9VoYfR8lQLG VwjcvOBnWOXmFjsWnLg9m/lUTvhh2MznlbivugsgX4Ps1Fw4s+eiT23/6EXAFwrdeuWr kKZ3RYpz0APpzmjoqGHycwqmoya5dosBAl2tEhTTahh2KRsnVZ2kCEGdrKAZFRsFBA37 yurBg+CaL9w5+b/7U1N+EpfyO2nkDNcf2RSykEyNQVPpCvqOCGj2iLdK1htauGHLcuXk hfYFz+77BrVVNY30DGeq5EfexQLoCWdSH0rNI7iaMEltDfR0hISKxXrHeV3VXqivzRt3 B8fg== MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: References: <50e186a2$0$6951$e4fe514c@news2.news.xs4all.nl> Date: Sat, 5 Jan 2013 02:34:56 +1100 Subject: Re: New to python, do I need an IDE or is vim still good enough? From: Chris Angelico To: python-list@python.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Newsgroups: comp.lang.python Message-ID: Lines: 36 NNTP-Posting-Host: 2001:888:2000:d::a6 X-Trace: 1357313699 news.xs4all.nl 6943 [2001:888:2000:d::a6]:35695 X-Complaints-To: abuse@xs4all.nl Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.python:36111 On Fri, Jan 4, 2013 at 6:34 PM, Anssi Saari wrote: > Ben Finney writes: > >> And any decent Unix-alike (most OSen apart from Windows) comes with its >> own IDE: the shell, a good text editor (Vim or Emacs being the primary >> candidates), and a terminal multiplexor (such as =91tmux=92 or GNU Scree= n). > > Just curious since I read the same thing in a programming book recently > (21st century C). So what's the greatness that terminal multiplexors > offer over tabbed terminals? Especially for software development? The main thing is that you'll need a _lot_ of terminals. On my Debian and Ubuntu GNOME-based systems, I tend to assign one desktop to each of several "modes", usually with my (tabbed) editor and browser on the first desktop. At the moment, desktop #3 (hit Ctrl-Alt-RightArrow twice) is for building Pike, running Gypsum, and git-managing Gypsum; desktop #2 is for my poltergeist controllers (MIDI to my keyboard), with a few different windows depending on what I'm doing; and desktop #1 is... everything else. SciTE, Google Chrome, a couple of Nautilus windows, and roughly twenty terminals doing various things like Command & Conquer Renegade, iptables management, SSH sessions to two other servers, the Yosemite project... wow, what a lot of random junk I have running on Sikorsky at the moment. It seems I currently have 25 instances of bash running, in addition to the non-bash windows. Tabbed terminals probably would work fine, but I've personally just never gotten accustomed to any. You will want some kind of system that lets you group related shell sessions together (eg one for 'make', one for running the app, and one for git, all relating to one project), and add more terminals to a group as required. The most important editing key is command recall (up arrow or similar), and keeping three or four different command histories per project is hugely advantageous. ChrisA