Path: csiph.com!v102.xanadu-bbs.net!xanadu-bbs.net!feeder.erje.net!eu.feeder.erje.net!newsfeed.xs4all.nl!newsfeed2.news.xs4all.nl!xs4all!newsgate.cistron.nl!newsgate.news.xs4all.nl!post.news.xs4all.nl!not-for-mail Return-Path: X-Original-To: python-list@python.org Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org X-Spam-Status: OK 0.099 X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 0.80; '*S*': 0.00; 'correct.': 0.07; 'part,': 0.09; 'subject:set': 0.09; 'subset': 0.09; 'runs': 0.10; 'cc:addr :python-list': 0.11; '*do': 0.16; 'finney': 0.16; 'from:addr:rosuav': 0.16; 'from:name:chris angelico': 0.16; 'wrote:': 0.18; 'wed,': 0.18; 'feb': 0.22; 'cc:addr:python.org': 0.22; 'cc:2**0': 0.24; 'certain': 0.27; 'header:In-Reply-To:1': 0.27; 'point': 0.28; 'said,': 0.30; 'message-id:@mail.gmail.com': 0.30; 'implied': 0.31; 'subject:numbers': 0.31; 'programmers': 0.33; 'subject:the': 0.34; "i'd": 0.34; 'could': 0.34; 'subject:with': 0.35; 'but': 0.35; 'received:google.com': 0.35; 'there': 0.35; 'done': 0.36; 'useful': 0.36; 'so,': 0.37; 'ben': 0.38; 'pm,': 0.38; 'rather': 0.38; '12,': 0.39; 'extremely': 0.39; 'enough': 0.39; 'referred': 0.60; 'most': 0.60; 'numbers': 0.61; "you've": 0.63; 'real': 0.63; 'education': 0.64; 'within': 0.65; 'natural': 0.68; 'optimized': 0.68; 'computers': 0.72; 'other.': 0.75; 'low': 0.83; '"real': 0.84; "everything's": 0.84; 'situations,': 0.84; 'to:none': 0.92 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:cc :content-type; bh=lV+lHQavuAfm/gqU2M3y2tWzvEYwHGgANzGqCBAKkuo=; b=ya4QjCSZBd63YyDjxadL+l/ZbzzWH7oWlBftkA3+n+SxfMuuP3MU9n2V0JazU8tHIL JE5//wvJIc76GjnPdA/ZKNKWZEtybasqgc7Z75zk1nVmGtmB9fgvTsM3wzfyVNVGzY4V c71c620NG3z8IwX3zdYF3yMPBZ+G6USVLPUhlariqepEef7w1IHknDA71csEROOcaZfu Gh4vmfoV5yG3kovBOSwizKqBeQ5nFZ/22A0Yo8zJXJLcJpHr4Nd+IrGYVFjYZU4rTgeb 2YCcpwUF9ppCRJNo6Ov6qHaMcPyqSLnnfW0W2n0s7LO/1eqWPiOAzlBLsmres0wMx2El E+PQ== MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.66.26.176 with SMTP id m16mr21504916pag.142.1392196596504; Wed, 12 Feb 2014 01:16:36 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <85ioskbtfm.fsf@benfinney.id.au> References: <8e4c1ab1-e65d-483f-ad9d-6933ae2052c3@googlegroups.com> <7e7d3200-a4ae-4842-ad8d-68b4435b9006@googlegroups.com> <52f219c5$0$29972$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <888bd2fc-54b0-4c46-9d7b-d81d01a78b52@googlegroups.com> <52f59aeb$0$29972$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <7cc8f49d-a4c7-48c2-a0af-ac58c847d794@googlegroups.com> <71e578f8-0d23-4b8e-b9f2-b987bdc9c01d@googlegroups.com> <85r478bv99.fsf_-_@benfinney.id.au> <85ioskbtfm.fsf@benfinney.id.au> Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2014 20:16:36 +1100 Subject: Re: Working with the set of real numbers From: Chris Angelico Cc: "python-list@python.org" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Newsgroups: comp.lang.python Message-ID: Lines: 21 NNTP-Posting-Host: 2001:888:2000:d::a6 X-Trace: 1392196605 news.xs4all.nl 2838 [2001:888:2000:d::a6]:42752 X-Complaints-To: abuse@xs4all.nl Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.python:66017 On Wed, Feb 12, 2014 at 7:56 PM, Ben Finney wrote: > So, if I understand you right, you want to say that you've not found a > computer that works with the *complete* set of real numbers. Yes? Correct. When jmf referred to real numbers, he implied that there are no optimizations done for natural numbers, that everything's just as efficient for any real number as for any other. My point is that computers *do not* work with real numbers, but only ever with some subset thereof, and that certain subsets (integers usually) are optimized for in ways that other subsets aren't. A true "real number" type might be useful in a few extremely narrow situations, but for the most part, I'd much rather have the optimized implementation that works with a subset thereof, and actually runs within reasonable time/space complexity. (Though, that said, I think a lot of programmers could do with some education on exactly _what_ subset of real numbers they're working with. The classic IEEE double-precision floating point type is good enough with low numbers that lots of people seem to think it stores reals, which it doesn't.) ChrisA