Path: csiph.com!x330-a1.tempe.blueboxinc.net!usenet.pasdenom.info!aioe.org!feeder.news-service.com!newsfeed.xs4all.nl!newsfeed6.news.xs4all.nl!xs4all!post.news.xs4all.nl!not-for-mail Return-Path: X-Original-To: python-list@python.org Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org X-Spam-Status: OK 0.013 X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 0.97; '*S*': 0.00; 'perl,': 0.05; 'forcing': 0.07; 'either.': 0.09; 'energy.': 0.09; 'reason.': 0.09; 'wed,': 0.12; 'am,': 0.13; 'wrote:': 0.15; '"stop': 0.16; 'accelerator': 0.16; 'cares': 0.16; 'from:addr:rosuav': 0.16; 'from:name:chris angelico': 0.16; 'jumping': 0.16; 'kinetic': 0.16; 'rantingrick': 0.16; 'programming': 0.18; 'driver': 0.19; 'received:209.85.210.174': 0.19; 'received:mail- iy0-f174.google.com': 0.19; 'header:In-Reply-To:1': 0.22; 'extent': 0.25; 'moving': 0.25; 'saying': 0.26; '(see': 0.28; 'bit': 0.28; 'message-id:@mail.gmail.com': 0.28; 'basics': 0.29; 'replaced': 0.29; "they'll": 0.30; 'class': 0.31; 'least': 0.31; 'programmers': 0.31; 'too': 0.32; 'generally': 0.33; 'people,': 0.33; 'actually': 0.33; 'to:addr:python-list': 0.34; 'difference': 0.34; 'force': 0.34; 'example,': 0.35; 'starting': 0.35; 'designing': 0.37; 'some': 0.37; 'languages': 0.37; 'but': 0.37; 'received:google.com': 0.38; 'received:209.85': 0.38; 'subject:: ': 0.38; 'think': 0.38; 'comments': 0.38; 'should': 0.39; "there's": 0.39; 'to:addr:python.org': 0.39; 'received:209': 0.40; 'views': 0.40; 'your': 0.60; 'road': 0.66; 'believe': 0.66; 'flow': 0.68; 'engine': 0.71; 'drivers': 0.73; 'hand,': 0.76; 'hundred': 0.76; '11:53': 0.84; 'ton': 0.84; 'steel': 0.91 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; bh=FPhvO5Icb2IxJ8mMyRFjjyYKQNPmvGCFWkhMlh3vVH0=; b=lwD+ejrO8aIGaLdgNKBYFlZJrZU9gxMOlSukWx3Q7v5NtxdNKkXpGKZaHPVqJZpWyp SQ3I2zXMScqopRS46r7fMGxp/i8ITHeqkDF2nE8CKnxeXU3JZwLEG7Mjs4WiNF/aaFZs gu2dcGUugdL25/ZcB5QN21nTyWNkE6g/rUj30= MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <20bd964d-a31d-4595-8ba7-c1923724a045@t7g2000vbv.googlegroups.com> References: <4e132d0f$0$29973$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <20bd964d-a31d-4595-8ba7-c1923724a045@t7g2000vbv.googlegroups.com> Date: Wed, 6 Jul 2011 12:44:52 +1000 Subject: Re: Implicit initialization is EXCELLENT From: Chris Angelico To: python-list@python.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Newsgroups: comp.lang.python Message-ID: Lines: 26 NNTP-Posting-Host: 2001:888:2000:d::a6 X-Trace: 1309920294 news.xs4all.nl 21760 [2001:888:2000:d::a6]:57955 X-Complaints-To: abuse@xs4all.nl Xref: x330-a1.tempe.blueboxinc.net comp.lang.python:8886 On Wed, Jul 6, 2011 at 11:53 AM, rantingrick wrote: > So you would start drivers education class with road construction? Or > the history of the internal combustion engine? Who cares about > actually *driving* the car. > I believe that starting driver ed with some basics of how an internal combustion engine works would be a Good Thing. If you're going to be in control of a ton of steel that's capable of moving at a hundred kays, you ought to know at least a bit about what provides the kinetic energy. There's a difference between comprehension and jumping through hoops. In your driver ed example, I don't believe that the accelerator pedal should be replaced with a flexible fuel-line that the driver squeezes to control flow to the engine; but on the other hand, I don't think the brake pedal should be replaced by a single button saying "stop car" either. Arrogance is a normal part of designing programming languages (see Larry Wall's comments regarding Perl, for instance). But arrogance to the extent of forcing your views on programmers is generally resented, and with good reason. If you force too much on people, they'll go elsewhere. ChrisA