Path: csiph.com!v102.xanadu-bbs.net!xanadu-bbs.net!feeder.erje.net!eu.feeder.erje.net!newsfeed.xs4all.nl!newsfeed1.news.xs4all.nl!xs4all!post.news.xs4all.nl!not-for-mail
Return-Path: <python@mrabarnett.plus.com>
X-Original-To: python-list@python.org
Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org
X-Spam-Status: OK 0.007
X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 0.99; '*S*': 0.00; 'c++,': 0.07; '__init__': 0.09; 'attributes': 0.09; 'constructor': 0.09; 'python': 0.11; '__init__,': 0.16; '__new__': 0.16; 'called,': 0.16; 'from:addr:mrabarnett.plus.com': 0.16; 'from:addr:python': 0.16; 'from:name:mrab': 0.16; 'message-id:@mrabarnett.plus.com': 0.16; 'pythonistas': 0.16; 'received:192.168.1.4': 0.16; 'roy': 0.16; ':-)': 0.16; 'wrote:': 0.18; "python's": 0.19; 'memory': 0.22; 'header:User-Agent:1': 0.23; 'sort': 0.25; "i've": 0.25; 'header :In-Reply-To:1': 0.27; '[1]': 0.29; "doesn't": 0.30; 'sets': 0.30; 'too.': 0.31; 'argue': 0.31; 'not.': 0.33; 'subject:the': 0.34; 'could': 0.34; 'but': 0.35; 'really': 0.36; 'c++': 0.36; 'useful': 0.36; 'to:addr:python-list': 0.38; 'heard': 0.39; 'to:addr:python.org': 0.39; 'complete': 0.62; 'smith': 0.68; 'construction': 0.72; 'article': 0.77; 'constructed.': 0.84; 'ethan': 0.84; 'furman': 0.84
X-CM-Score: 0.00
X-CNFS-Analysis: v=2.1 cv=eZmzft0H c=1 sm=1 tr=0 a=0nF1XD0wxitMEM03M9B4ZQ==:117 a=0nF1XD0wxitMEM03M9B4ZQ==:17 a=0Bzu9jTXAAAA:8 a=5FYZ9MsUIQAA:10 a=ihvODaAuJD4A:10 a=IkcTkHD0fZMA:10 a=EBOSESyhAAAA:8 a=1U9r9e_U-9MA:10 a=8AHkEIZyAAAA:8 a=bXfzu9LNwsP-bdXKzqkA:9 a=QEXdDO2ut3YA:10 a=VhVvL8HfBcoA:10 a=ExiFL-q3zkAA:10
X-AUTH: mrabarnett:2500
Date: Sat, 01 Feb 2014 01:41:26 +0000
From: MRAB <python@mrabarnett.plus.com>
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.3; WOW64; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.2.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: python-list@python.org
Subject: Re: __init__ is the initialiser
References: <lcgtpf$tui$1@ger.gmane.org> <lcgut2$b8r$1@ger.gmane.org> <858utviwgs.fsf@benfinney.id.au> <lchce7$44q$1@ger.gmane.org> <mailman.6233.1391214984.18130.python-list@python.org> <roy-EDB0E1.20104631012014@news.panix.com>
In-Reply-To: <roy-EDB0E1.20104631012014@news.panix.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15
Precedence: list
List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language <python-list.python.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-list>, <mailto:python-list-request@python.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-list/>
List-Post: <mailto:python-list@python.org>
List-Help: <mailto:python-list-request@python.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list>, <mailto:python-list-request@python.org?subject=subscribe>
Newsgroups: comp.lang.python
Message-ID: <mailman.6238.1391218886.18130.python-list@python.org>
Lines: 24
NNTP-Posting-Host: 2001:888:2000:d::a6
X-Trace: 1391218886 news.xs4all.nl 2918 [2001:888:2000:d::a6]:49908
X-Complaints-To: abuse@xs4all.nl
Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.python:65159

On 2014-02-01 01:10, Roy Smith wrote:
> In article <mailman.6233.1391214984.18130.python-list@python.org>,
>   Ethan Furman <ethan@stoneleaf.us> wrote:
>
>> I found calling __init__ the constructor very confusing.
>
> I've heard many people say this, and it's always sort of befuddled me.
>
> In C++, a constructor is really an initializer too.  By the time C++'s
> Foo::Foo() or Python's Foo.__init__() get called, memory has already
> been allocated, so I would say the object has been constructed.  Yet,
> C++ people are perfectly happy calling this "thing that takes some
> allocated hunk of memory and sets its attributes to useful values" a
> constructor[1], and Python people are not.
>
You could argue that construction is not complete until the instance
has been initialised. In the case of C++, all you have is the
initialiser, so doesn't really matter, but Python has __new__ and
__init__, so it _does_ matter.

> [1] Well, they really call it a ctor, but I chalk that up to the same
> sort of silliness that makes pythonistas pronounce "__" as "dunder" :-)
>