Path: csiph.com!usenet.pasdenom.info!gegeweb.org!usenet-fr.net!nerim.net!novso.com!newsfeed.xs4all.nl!newsfeed3.news.xs4all.nl!xs4all!newsgate.cistron.nl!newsgate.news.xs4all.nl!post.news.xs4all.nl!not-for-mail Return-Path: X-Original-To: python-list@python.org Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org X-Spam-Status: OK 0.001 X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 1.00; '*S*': 0.00; 'mrab': 0.05; 'python)': 0.05; 'constructor': 0.09; 'creation,': 0.09; 'instance.': 0.09; 'received:80.91': 0.09; 'received:80.91.229': 0.09; 'received:gmane.org': 0.09; 'received:list': 0.09; 'sentence': 0.09; 'warn': 0.09; 'python': 0.11; '>the': 0.16; '__new__': 0.16; 'created.': 0.16; 'creation.': 0.16; 'finney': 0.16; 'operation.': 0.16; 'received:80.91.229.3': 0.16; 'received:plane.gmane.org': 0.16; 'simpson': 0.16; 'succinct': 0.16; ':-)': 0.16; 'wrote:': 0.18; 'seems': 0.21; 'separate': 0.22; 'header:User-Agent:1': 0.23; 'basis,': 0.24; 'earlier': 0.24; 'header:X-Complaints-To:1': 0.27; "doesn't": 0.30; 'getting': 0.31; 'usually': 0.31; 'writes:': 0.31; 'supposed': 0.32; 'reader': 0.33; 'subject:the': 0.34; 'there': 0.35; 'explains': 0.36; 'false': 0.36; 'received:com.au': 0.36; 'so,': 0.37; 'clear': 0.37; 'ben': 0.38; 'convention': 0.38; 'to:addr:python-list': 0.38; 'pm,': 0.38; 'to:addr:python.org': 0.39; 'received:org': 0.40; 'called': 0.40; 'new': 0.61; 'skip:\xe2 10': 0.65; 'line,': 0.68; 'of:': 0.68; '8bit%:43': 0.74; 'special': 0.74; '100%': 0.77; '8bit%:46': 0.78; 'received:125': 0.84; 'step.': 0.91 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ To: python-list@python.org From: Ben Finney Subject: Re: __init__ is the initialiser Date: Sat, 01 Feb 2014 10:47:42 +1100 References: <52EC0E3C.5070900@stoneleaf.us> <20140131224507.GA5454@cskk.homeip.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: vmx15867.hosting24.com.au X-Public-Key-ID: 0xBD41714B X-Public-Key-Fingerprint: 9CFE 12B0 791A 4267 887F 520C B7AC 2E51 BD41 714B X-Public-Key-URL: http://www.benfinney.id.au/contact/bfinney-gpg.asc X-Post-From: Ben Finney User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/23.4 (gnu/linux) Cancel-Lock: sha1:cCF68WRn0m6+By9DkkiW7fEO8tA= X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Newsgroups: comp.lang.python Message-ID: Lines: 38 NNTP-Posting-Host: 2001:888:2000:d::a6 X-Trace: 1391212076 news.xs4all.nl 2968 [2001:888:2000:d::a6]:51141 X-Complaints-To: abuse@xs4all.nl Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.python:65151 Cameron Simpson writes: > > On 01/31/2014 12:48 PM, MRAB wrote: > > >The advantage of calling it the "initialiser" is that it explains > > >why it's called "__init__". > > On this basis, would it suffice to change the opening sentence from: > Called when the instance is created. > > to > Called to initialise a new instance immediately after creation. > > ? > > This seems succinct while getting both "initialise" and "new" into the > line, which makes it clear that there is a separate and earlier "new" > step. (Conveniently overridable with __new__ :-) It leaves a naive reader (who isn't yet familiar with the convention for special names in Python) with the false implication that “__init__” is usually called *manually*. I would prefer it to be clear that “__init__” is called automatically, *during* the constructor's operation. So, instead of: Called when the instance is created. I suggest: Called automatically by the constructor “__new__” during instance creation, to initialise the new instance. -- \ “Why doesn't Python warn that it's not 100% perfect? Are people | `\ just supposed to “know” this, magically?” —Mitya Sirenef, | _o__) comp.lang.python, 2012-12-27 | Ben Finney