Path: csiph.com!news.swapon.de!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!not-for-mail From: Random832 Newsgroups: comp.lang.python Subject: Re: I'm wrong or Will we fix the ducks limp? Date: Tue, 07 Jun 2016 11:14:30 -0400 Lines: 25 Message-ID: References: <87mvn22veg.fsf@rudin.co.uk> <13108bea-6750-443b-bee8-0532aba8b338@googlegroups.com> <5753c89b$0$1616$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <1465148542.2670061.628500777.62F1EFE1@webmail.messagingengine.com> <5754f36b$0$1619$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <5755a2a5$0$1611$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <1465232248.1109132.629464689.31293D92@webmail.messagingengine.com> <5755c809$0$1622$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <1465247581.1161240.629720825.10FE129E@webmail.messagingengine.com> <87shwq56s8.fsf@elektro.pacujo.net> <1465312470.1376520.630519945.7DA4FE0E@webmail.messagingengine.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de WBsbY25kGUSrYhy+Ye5EYwixSj+opngbMXgrJenuZadw== Return-Path: X-Original-To: python-list@python.org Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org X-Spam-Status: OK 0.001 X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 1.00; '*S*': 0.00; "'a'": 0.07; 'lookup': 0.09; 'received:internal': 0.09; 'spelled': 0.09; "'b',": 0.16; "'c'": 0.16; 'distinct': 0.16; 'function"': 0.16; 'gregory': 0.16; 'message-id:@webmail.messagingengine.com': 0.16; 'operators,': 0.16; 'received:10.202': 0.16; 'received:10.202.2': 0.16; 'received:66.111': 0.16; 'received:66.111.4': 0.16; 'received:io': 0.16; 'received:messagingengine.com': 0.16; 'received:psf.io': 0.16; 'value"': 0.16; 'wrote:': 0.16; "wouldn't": 0.16; 'attribute': 0.18; 'variable': 0.18; 'variables.': 0.22; 'header :In-Reply-To:1': 0.24; 'sense': 0.26; 'not.': 0.27; 'operations': 0.31; 'holds': 0.32; 'equal': 0.34; 'tue,': 0.34; 'that,': 0.34; 'something': 0.35; 'to:addr:python-list': 0.36; 'subject:?': 0.36; 'subject:: ': 0.37; 'received:10': 0.37; 'really': 0.37; 'two': 0.37; 'being': 0.37; 'received:66': 0.38; 'mean': 0.38; 'means': 0.39; 'why': 0.39; 'does': 0.39; 'subject:the': 0.39; 'to:addr:python.org': 0.40; 'still': 0.40; 'header:Message-Id:1': 0.61; 'different': 0.63; "it'd": 0.84 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=fastmail.com; h= content-transfer-encoding:content-type:date:from:in-reply-to :message-id:mime-version:references:subject:to:x-sasl-enc :x-sasl-enc; s=mesmtp; bh=FjRScBPr1RqQ7OoOhonoZSYuFqk=; b=TD4epE Jmoooxi+8GTS5qrGcyzSE9OenYjvPEPsaSYQuYsL8jIPVFeCsYFU+Jx5/lJgPHvH fzHVYJZP4CuDXMqtge0Nlkd24sY+kFlc1sloZehEs/9zSRI4JsisNcZeMpein+/C zd+v0k6XXjgWBGDYTsA5PBNmv3LUww6TLvATQ= DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=content-transfer-encoding:content-type :date:from:in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version:references :subject:to:x-sasl-enc:x-sasl-enc; s=smtpout; bh=FjRScBPr1RqQ7Oo OhonoZSYuFqk=; b=K0WNb0KVo2QfZp32GxzxGJKMggjMODgeOMAw07XFJYXDzbC UxJ5u2P6x/5cukRx6vW7eSRPa9b7767InIGiQaRuYhoCIPoUTAE48fXEXlcUXWoc MRIhvX1fmEH7tergs2WxNvUPr36uq96kqbB0BlzaEwU9gNO5YXkXSpQnizJg= X-Sasl-Enc: ceiVJReI8erVOKLGNWssacGREMfGP3lY5U1hLHqreGMC 1465312470 X-Mailer: MessagingEngine.com Webmail Interface - ajax-7f2506ab In-Reply-To: X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Mailman-Original-Message-ID: <1465312470.1376520.630519945.7DA4FE0E@webmail.messagingengine.com> X-Mailman-Original-References: <87mvn22veg.fsf@rudin.co.uk> <13108bea-6750-443b-bee8-0532aba8b338@googlegroups.com> <5753c89b$0$1616$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <1465148542.2670061.628500777.62F1EFE1@webmail.messagingengine.com> <5754f36b$0$1619$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <5755a2a5$0$1611$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <1465232248.1109132.629464689.31293D92@webmail.messagingengine.com> <5755c809$0$1622$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <1465247581.1161240.629720825.10FE129E@webmail.messagingengine.com> <87shwq56s8.fsf@elektro.pacujo.net> Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.python:109628 On Tue, Jun 7, 2016, at 03:03, Gregory Ewing wrote: > a = 42 > b = 17 > c = &a > c = &b > > does 'c' now hold a reference to the variable 'b', or > does it still hold a reference to 'a' and 'a' now > holds a reference to 'b'? It'd have to be spelled *c = &b, or c.value = &b or c.setvalue(&b), or something like that, to mean the latter. > Somehow these two operations would have to be spelled > different ways, which means you would need to know > whether you were dealing with a variable reference or > not. So they wouldn't really be first-class, in the > sense of being treated on an equal footing with > ordinary variables. Er, how would that make them not first class? Lots of operations need to be spelled differently, that's why we have so many operators, attribute lookup syntax, etc. "Assign to the variable object that is in this variable" would be a distinct operation from "Assign to this variable", just like "add one to this value" or "call this function" etc.