Path: csiph.com!usenet.pasdenom.info!weretis.net!feeder1.news.weretis.net!feeder.erje.net!eu.feeder.erje.net!ecngs!feeder2.ecngs.de!novso.com!newsfeed.xs4all.nl!newsfeed1.news.xs4all.nl!xs4all!post.news.xs4all.nl!not-for-mail
Return-Path: <python-python-list@m.gmane.org>
X-Original-To: python-list@python.org
Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org
X-Spam-Status: OK 0.003
X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 0.99; '*S*': 0.00; 'from:addr:yahoo.co.uk': 0.04; 'subject:Python': 0.06; 'contributor': 0.07; 'dev': 0.07; 'lawrence': 0.09; 'pep': 0.09; 'received:80.91': 0.09; 'received:80.91.229': 0.09; 'received:gmane.org': 0.09; 'received:list': 0.09; 'uses.': 0.09; 'whole.': 0.09; '~ethan~': 0.09; 'python': 0.11; 'bug': 0.12; 'missed': 0.12; 'language.': 0.14; 'devs': 0.16; 'mark,': 0.16; 'received:80.91.229.3': 0.16; 'received:plane.gmane.org': 0.16; 'referencing': 0.16; 'roy': 0.16; 'survive': 0.16; 'which,': 0.16; 'worst': 0.16; 'language': 0.16; 'fix': 0.17; 'wrote:': 0.18; 'figures': 0.19; '>>>': 0.22; 'header:User-Agent:1': 0.23; 'aspect': 0.24; 'tracker': 0.26; 'gets': 0.27; 'header:X-Complaints-To:1': 0.27; 'header:In-Reply- To:1': 0.27; 'am,': 0.29; "doesn't": 0.30; "i'm": 0.30; 'gives': 0.31; 'enforce': 0.31; 'regular': 0.32; 'open': 0.33; 'community': 0.33; 'whom': 0.33; 'core': 0.34; 'subject:the': 0.34; 'created': 0.35; 'convert': 0.35; 'but': 0.35; 'there': 0.35; 'dates': 0.36; "didn't": 0.36; 'should': 0.36; 'effort': 0.37; 'list': 0.37; 'easily': 0.37; 'to:addr:python-list': 0.38; 'rather': 0.38; 'to:addr:python.org': 0.39; 'received:org': 0.40; 'even': 0.60; 'everybody': 0.60; 'hope': 0.61; 'today.': 0.61; 'simply': 0.61; 'you.': 0.62; 'times': 0.62; "you'll": 0.62; 'high': 0.63; 'our': 0.64; 'more': 0.64; 'talking': 0.65; 'life': 0.66; 'smith': 0.68; 'us,': 0.73; '10th': 0.84; '2.8': 0.84; 'alone.': 0.84; 'celebrated': 0.84; 'ethan': 0.84; 'furman': 0.84; 'horse': 0.84
X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/
To: python-list@python.org
From: Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: the Gravity of Python 2
Date: Thu, 09 Jan 2014 18:18:20 +0000
References: <laf00q$10k$1@ger.gmane.org> <mailman.5098.1389053970.18130.python-list@python.org> <78d91$52cbf8e9$541826b9$29485@cache1.tilbu1.nb.home.nl> <4b702$52cc262e$541826b9$22985@cache80.multikabel.net> <4cbf$52cc2e82$541826b9$11761@cache70.multikabel.net> <mailman.5141.1389114029.18130.python-list@python.org> <686$52cd4640$541826b9$21896@cache1.tilbu1.nb.home.nl> <roy-C787B2.09153508012014@news.panix.com> <mailman.5170.1389191449.18130.python-list@python.org> <laknps$umv$1@dont-email.me> <roy-B40DB1.20273008012014@news.panix.com> <lalne1$ecc$1@ger.gmane.org> <52CEC7E5.60908@stoneleaf.us>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: host-78-147-21-105.as13285.net
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.2.0
In-Reply-To: <52CEC7E5.60908@stoneleaf.us>
X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15
Precedence: list
List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language <python-list.python.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-list>, <mailto:python-list-request@python.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-list/>
List-Post: <mailto:python-list@python.org>
List-Help: <mailto:python-list-request@python.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list>, <mailto:python-list-request@python.org?subject=subscribe>
Newsgroups: comp.lang.python
Message-ID: <mailman.5275.1389291532.18130.python-list@python.org>
Lines: 38
NNTP-Posting-Host: 2001:888:2000:d::a6
X-Trace: 1389291532 news.xs4all.nl 2917 [2001:888:2000:d::a6]:58718
X-Complaints-To: abuse@xs4all.nl
Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.python:63622

On 09/01/2014 16:01, Ethan Furman wrote:
> On 01/09/2014 12:42 AM, Mark Lawrence wrote:
>> On 09/01/2014 01:27, Roy Smith wrote:
>>>
>>> Naive datetimes are what everybody uses.  It's what utcnow() gives you.
>>> So why make life difficult for everybody?  Python 3 didn't win a convert
>>> today.
>>
>> Yep, dates and times are easy.  That's why there are 17 issues open on
>> the bug tracker referencing tzinfo alone.  Poor
>> old 1100942 is high priority, was created 12/01/2005 and has missed
>> 3.4.  So if it gets into 3.5 it'll have already
>> celebrated its 10th birthday.  It doesn't say much for the amount of
>> effort that we put into looking after issues.
>
> Mark, I hope you are addressing the community at large and not the
> core-devs.  There are only so many of us, with limited time available.
>
> --
> ~Ethan~

As I'm not a core dev to whom do you think I'm referring?  I'm aware 
that the high horse I get on about this is so tall that you'll need an 
oxygen supply to survive should you want to sit on it, but to me this is 
easily the worst aspect of the Python community as a whole.  If every 
regular contributor to this list was to fix even one bug a week the 
figures would look rather better.  Still, you can no more enforce that 
than you can enforce the core devs working on Python 2.8 :)

Talking of which, have we got a PEP for that yet, or are the whingers 
still simply in whinging mode?

-- 
My fellow Pythonistas, ask not what our language can do for you, ask 
what you can do for our language.

Mark Lawrence