Path: csiph.com!usenet.pasdenom.info!weretis.net!feeder4.news.weretis.net!feeds.phibee-telecom.net!newsfeed.xs4all.nl!newsfeed4.news.xs4all.nl!xs4all!post.news.xs4all.nl!not-for-mail Return-Path: X-Original-To: python-list@python.org Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org X-Spam-Status: OK 0.034 X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 0.93; '*S*': 0.00; 'python.': 0.02; 'programmer': 0.03; 'subject:not': 0.03; '(at': 0.04; 'extent': 0.07; 'subject:help': 0.08; 'coding,': 0.09; 'returns,': 0.09; 'runs': 0.10; 'python': 0.11; 'achievement.': 0.16; 'bit.': 0.16; 'from:addr:rosuav': 0.16; 'from:name:chris angelico': 0.16; 'fun;': 0.16; 'hostname': 0.16; 'programmers.': 0.16; 'wooden': 0.16; 'wrote:': 0.18; 'wed,': 0.18; 'work,': 0.20; 'seems': 0.21; 'sends': 0.24; "haven't": 0.24; "i've": 0.25; 'header:In-Reply- To:1': 0.27; 'am,': 0.29; 'scale': 0.29; 'message- id:@mail.gmail.com': 0.30; 'code': 0.31; 'easier': 0.31; 'lines': 0.31; 'subject:what': 0.31; 'file': 0.32; 'probably': 0.32; 'run': 0.32; 'quite': 0.32; 'beginning': 0.33; 'computer.': 0.33; 'maybe': 0.34; 'subject: (': 0.35; 'display': 0.35; 'but': 0.35; 'received:google.com': 0.35; 'there': 0.35; 'next': 0.36; 'useful': 0.36; 'remote': 0.38; 'to:addr:python-list': 0.38; 'ability': 0.39; 'aspects': 0.39; 'environment.': 0.39; 'to:addr:python.org': 0.39; 'how': 0.40; 'even': 0.60; 'read': 0.60; 'most': 0.60; 'black': 0.61; 'making': 0.63; 'happen': 0.63; 'week,': 0.64; 'teach': 0.65; 'within': 0.65; 'effectively': 0.66; 'investment': 0.66; 'here': 0.66; 'duty': 0.68; 'car': 0.72; 'jul': 0.74; 'discover': 0.82; 'hardly': 0.84; 'madness': 0.84; 'subject:!)': 0.84; 'subject:think': 0.84; 'subject:you': 0.87; 'joel': 0.91; 'novice': 0.91; 'roads': 0.91; 'angry': 0.93; '2013': 0.98 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; bh=xbdevjPVN+s3g4KbE7EqnFihQ6LmgiFV4svOr6OP1Qg=; b=zfZyzfwD+l1xcRGYQVXmYUp01ivIc2vSBOMDM9A8BsThDdnHMfhvMF56jblxr5yucd 4+846Ereg/zwW1O0R+upxwPX4MQ1fCKMw12VB7ngo9QnzgkMlcovT9dbMkzLXBuoetK8 kJ2lCALOoUCmN4MtNV2UsNbJGG+4zdNj73JRv53wA+RRRCSPBkMmlp0cyqk89pgu7Jn3 PMYyVcXEgd/30ldlaFTJms4XwUWrR13giuVqr9perKolw6frsnu+sKMGobar2PiWQvpL Y25nNumO6BkiOcx2FjBKqeV1Ex56fs6X4c3xK7XmnYzjeSRInGEUm5hCwpfnT/S0Pr71 MzHw== MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.220.169.146 with SMTP id z18mr1274654vcy.80.1374024876168; Tue, 16 Jul 2013 18:34:36 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <44c11575-2481-4220-9d3c-b53879e9cd8f@googlegroups.com> Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2013 11:34:36 +1000 Subject: Re: Homework help requested (not what you think!) From: Chris Angelico To: python-list@python.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Newsgroups: comp.lang.python Message-ID: Lines: 26 NNTP-Posting-Host: 2001:888:2000:d::a6 X-Trace: 1374024879 news.xs4all.nl 15890 [2001:888:2000:d::a6]:55676 X-Complaints-To: abuse@xs4all.nl Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.python:50769 On Wed, Jul 17, 2013 at 10:53 AM, Joel Goldstick wrote: > There is a book : http://inventwithpython.com/ Invent Your Own Computer > Games with Python > which claims to teach people to program games in python. I haven't read it, > but it seems to be for beginning programmers. Take a look.. Maybe it would > work for your kids. Not my siblings specifically, but I've seen this happen elsewhere quite a bit. Thing is, they still won't be making the next Call of Duty Black Ops, or Alice: Madness Returns, or even the next Angry Birds. It's like looking at the roads and how car manufacturers produce things that run from here to Sydney, and then learning how to build a go-kart with wooden wheels - strong disappointment in the scale of achievement. Which is a pity, because that go-kart can be a lot of fun; the novice programmer has to get past that disappointment and discover the other fun aspects of coding, like the ability to improve your own environment. (At work, one of my most useful oddments of code is a log tailing system that runs on each of N remote servers and effectively runs "tail -F foo.log" for each of M log files, tags the lines with the hostname and log file name, and sends it to a single display on my computer. Makes my job easier to the extent that I probably paid off the time investment within a week, but it's hardly glamorous stuff.) ChrisA