Path: csiph.com!usenet.pasdenom.info!gegeweb.org!de-l.enfer-du-nord.net!feeder2.enfer-du-nord.net!feeds.phibee-telecom.net!newsfeed.xs4all.nl!newsfeed3.news.xs4all.nl!xs4all!post.news.xs4all.nl!not-for-mail Return-Path: X-Original-To: python-list@python.org Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org X-Spam-Status: OK 0.106 X-Spam-Level: * X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 0.81; '*S*': 0.02; 'subject:not': 0.03; 'automate': 0.07; 'subject:help': 0.08; 'from:addr:rosuav': 0.16; 'from:name:chris angelico': 0.16; 'mundane': 0.16; 'programmer,': 0.16; 'think.': 0.16; 'wrote:': 0.18; 'wed,': 0.18; 'bit': 0.19; 'starts': 0.20; 'written': 0.21; 'programming': 0.22; 'header:In- Reply-To:1': 0.27; 'am,': 0.29; "doesn't": 0.30; 'message- id:@mail.gmail.com': 0.30; "i'm": 0.30; 'subject:what': 0.31; 'subject: (': 0.35; 'but': 0.35; 'received:google.com': 0.35; 'really': 0.36; 'next': 0.36; 'should': 0.36; 'half': 0.37; 'easily': 0.37; 'to:addr:python-list': 0.38; 'to:addr:python.org': 0.39; 'how': 0.40; 'john': 0.61; 'show': 0.63; 'real': 0.63; 'more': 0.64; 'sound': 0.68; 'jul': 0.74; '("this': 0.84; 'plays': 0.84; 'subject:!)': 0.84; 'subject:think': 0.84; 'subject:you': 0.87; 'novice': 0.91; '2013': 0.98 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; bh=9aHL+coIYTKFfnkmdwb8ZfcnV3K05egPuXFek9Cd8Ic=; b=LP4MyWkZqzULUh/KN6PQJ3RKhjWSLX080pqwZ3FfNuDFYmcB0OZxgijmhqTTNep+xP WDVPOI2n70+Gdexg8a9WqnL+VjWWO510Tp7R+ul3FjEd1+Bjth93AohixMqE2x+HOjCR j9CdriFy4Gpi1bW9bpMDzWz3HgfbMnPwUf+xZen4IEv6i7QYT8rwAr73+dE4avDGwR/A QqGZQu+4zkMl4Qh8kU5xCO/iYk1xD36muujF4Dc8UbX6mnLHcaCWS0mqkVudbTQOs3w4 ymvC0qvBJULpMD9GiAoAPeCZjNfSoxrdrn+mtq4gxWdHwz2NOsrm4Neott/Fv5uenrES K8oQ== MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.59.9.69 with SMTP id dq5mr1175564ved.87.1374021631881; Tue, 16 Jul 2013 17:40:31 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <44c11575-2481-4220-9d3c-b53879e9cd8f@googlegroups.com> References: <44c11575-2481-4220-9d3c-b53879e9cd8f@googlegroups.com> Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2013 10:40:31 +1000 Subject: Re: Homework help requested (not what you think!) From: Chris Angelico To: python-list@python.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Newsgroups: comp.lang.python Message-ID: Lines: 16 NNTP-Posting-Host: 2001:888:2000:d::a6 X-Trace: 1374021635 news.xs4all.nl 15959 [2001:888:2000:d::a6]:60948 X-Complaints-To: abuse@xs4all.nl Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.python:50765 On Wed, Jul 17, 2013 at 8:43 AM, John Ladasky wrote: > I think that they're disappointed when I show them how much they have to understand just to write a program that plays Tic Tac Toe. The disillusionment of every novice programmer, I think. It starts out as "I want to learn programming and make a game". Real programming is more like "I can automate mundane tasks", which doesn't sound half as exciting. But this is why I'm dubious of programming courses that actually try to hold onto the "let's make a game" concept, because the students are likely to get a bit of a let-down on realizing that it really doesn't work that easily ("this is a two-week course, at the end of it I should have written the next for all my friends"). ChrisA