Path: csiph.com!usenet.pasdenom.info!news.redatomik.org!newsfeed.xs4all.nl!newsfeed7.news.xs4all.nl!nzpost1.xs4all.net!not-for-mail
Return-Path: <rosuav@gmail.com>
X-Original-To: python-list@python.org
Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org
X-Spam-Status: OK 0.001
X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 1.00; '*S*': 0.00; 'python,': 0.02; 'cpython': 0.05; 'extent': 0.07; 'pypy': 0.07; 'cc:addr:python-list': 0.09; 'python': 0.10; 'language,': 0.11; 'question.': 0.13; 'times,': 0.13; 'missed': 0.15; 'folks': 0.15; "hasn't": 0.15; 'from:addr:rosuav': 0.16; 'from:name:chris angelico': 0.16; 'porn': 0.16; 'subject:reference': 0.16; 'subject:versus': 0.16; 'wrote:': 0.16; 'language': 0.19; '2015': 0.20; 'cc:2**0': 0.20; 'cc:addr:python.org': 0.20; 'saying': 0.22; 'gcc': 0.22; 'sep': 0.22; 'am,': 0.23; 'academic': 0.23; 'thus': 0.24; 'header:In- Reply-To:1': 0.24; 'developers': 0.26; 'chris': 0.26; 'define': 0.27; 'not.': 0.27; 'switch': 0.27; 'message-id:@mail.gmail.com': 0.27; 'converting': 0.27; 'device': 0.28; '13,': 0.29; 'behaviour': 0.29; 'push': 0.30; 'another': 0.32; 'implement': 0.32; 'definition': 0.34; 'languages': 0.34; 'received:google.com': 0.35; 'done': 0.35; 'ahead': 0.35; 'sometimes': 0.35; 'but': 0.36; 'subject:" ': 0.36; 'subject:: ': 0.37; 'being': 0.37; 'does': 0.39; 'rather': 0.39; 'some': 0.40; 'high': 0.60; 'claim': 0.61; 'art': 0.62; 'between': 0.65; 'forward': 0.66; 'chrisa': 0.84; 'distinguish': 0.84; 'python- dev': 0.84; 'reminds': 0.84; 'to:none': 0.91
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:cc :content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=0RKTIS4MlMdJBKgO6ya0lntzpVZWNt6JewDNn0NUdlo=; b=U4X/6BfIPKrjTBv3u6NA55LBCyhJnTnFHFxuacyBtR7PnV92w/ZzPfXOKyBct9YcHE Xx3yFLI8V9rvqFC45Ln9LDzH+seL6dRyC2YB3nIzO8ApSn+ubdwhEO5ZKoL58Evfc6FE OH1Yfit3Gg7feHgHJttFFg8d72P0b3j9IrpUH2M65vmyOB8P/N0eV87+AfH8JFGXyamA lPlfKLFoSsuBuIcr6GkovRZo4bjsPgHvQNWgHHI4cYY2eTFC8YKy4I3GPiWyxnNBm1BL keTe8J0qZkuhYzFn+OWpYDrDWcCMquR98F6Mazxq6O1tXXbRcbcfzaWNYk+sfdbPv8Kn PZeA==
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-Received: by 10.50.98.7 with SMTP id ee7mr7499035igb.13.1442103554945; Sat, 12 Sep 2015 17:19:14 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To: <239d70be-e78b-41d9-ad7b-c50461971784@googlegroups.com>
References: <c3363$547e74fe$5419aafe$24179@news.ziggo.nl> <14afe27e-0bd5-410f-8e64-0f31d496ebf2@googlegroups.com> <b695e$55f34cad$d47876e2$41259@news.ziggo.nl> <55F36B4C.9020007@gmail.com> <1442016698.95299.381478313.2487CA0E@webmail.messagingengine.com> <mt04ao$ite$1@ger.gmane.org> <m2zj0ss2md.fsf@fastmail.com> <85mvws6z45.fsf_-_@benfinney.id.au> <m2k2rws0yr.fsf@fastmail.com> <85io7g6xy4.fsf@benfinney.id.au> <m2egi4rzz5.fsf@fastmail.com> <85egi46wng.fsf@benfinney.id.au> <m2zj0sqjl8.fsf@fastmail.com> <mailman.419.1442039210.8327.python-list@python.org> <d55daf4b-b7c2-41fb-8010-76d6d65eb6b8@googlegroups.com> <mailman.425.1442068881.8327.python-list@python.org> <1a1a1f6a-27ce-4c1b-807a-43eabaa04abb@googlegroups.com> <8e16c020-e734-401d-92cb-10a2cdddd497@googlegroups.com> <55f4657f$0$1675$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <0034a8bd-cd81-4c5e-9759-1ce1aa97e2e2@googlegroups.com> <mailman.455.1442096077.8327.python-list@python.org> <0f742e14-1983-42ae-a774-f8a9f3485e34@googlegroups.com> <239d70be-e78b-41d9-ad7b-c50461971784@googlegroups.com>
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 2015 10:19:14 +1000
Subject: Re: Terminology: "reference" versus "pointer"
From: Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com>
Cc: "python-list@python.org" <python-list@python.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20+
Precedence: list
List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language <python-list.python.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-list>, <mailto:python-list-request@python.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-list/>
List-Post: <mailto:python-list@python.org>
List-Help: <mailto:python-list-request@python.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list>, <mailto:python-list-request@python.org?subject=subscribe>
Newsgroups: comp.lang.python
Message-ID: <mailman.458.1442103563.8327.python-list@python.org>
Lines: 29
NNTP-Posting-Host: 2001:888:2000:d::a6
X-Trace: 1442103563 news.xs4all.nl 23843 [2001:888:2000:d::a6]:50677
X-Complaints-To: abuse@xs4all.nl
Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.python:96471

On Sun, Sep 13, 2015 at 9:39 AM, Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> wrote:
> To which we have Chris saying CPython =E2=89=A0 Python
> Which reminds me of another definition
> Fig-Leaf: A device for converting poor porn into high art
>
> Even in languages like C with an ISO standard adhering to the standard is
> academic (gcc's switch is --pedantic) and it is in practice major
> implementations like gcc and MSC that define and push the standard.
>
> In python, CPython is the standard and other implementations can lay clai=
m to
> being 'python' to the extent that they adhere to the standard.
>
> Or have I missed some ISO-ization?

ISO hasn't standardized Python, but the Python developers do
distinguish between the language and the various implementations. Yes,
CPython does push forward ahead of the others, and thus sometimes
another Python will replicate CPython behaviour rather than seeking an
official language pronouncement; but other times, the PyPy or Jython
or Brython folks come to python-dev with a question. As a general
rule, most PEPs are about the language, not the implementation, so you
can eyeball those to see what you'd need to implement to write a
Python from scratch.

CPython does not intrinsically define the standard. Some languages are
done this way (Pike, for instance), but Python is not.

ChrisA