Path: csiph.com!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!not-for-mail From: Chris Angelico Newsgroups: comp.lang.python Subject: Re: Question Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2016 06:47:48 +1100 Lines: 40 Message-ID: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de Q+K7wHaamAjaN+7BfBNK0AyHFjF0wzdS599necw/xNaw== Return-Path: X-Original-To: python-list@python.org Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org X-Spam-Status: OK 0.003 X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 0.99; '*S*': 0.00; 'python,': 0.02; 'received:209.85.223': 0.03; 'subject:Question': 0.05; 'plenty': 0.07; 'cc:addr:python-list': 0.09; 'indeed,': 0.09; 'python': 0.10; 'systems.': 0.11; '2016': 0.16; 'different,': 0.16; 'from:addr:rosuav': 0.16; 'from:name:chris angelico': 0.16; 'hardware.': 0.16; 'personally,': 0.16; 'pygame': 0.16; 'received:io': 0.16; 'received:psf.io': 0.16; 'rough': 0.16; 'virtualbox': 0.16; 'wrote:': 0.16; 'stick': 0.18; 'shell': 0.18; 'changes': 0.20; 'windows': 0.20; 'cc:2**0': 0.20; 'cc:addr:python.org': 0.20; 'cloud': 0.20; 'fix': 0.21; 'work,': 0.21; 'do.': 0.22; 'am,': 0.23; 'bit': 0.23; '(or': 0.23; "python's": 0.23; 'header:In-Reply-To:1': 0.24; 'script': 0.25; "doesn't": 0.26; 'packaging': 0.27; 'message-id:@mail.gmail.com': 0.27; 'interface': 0.29; 'complain': 0.29; 'windows,': 0.29; 'fixed': 0.31; 'option': 0.31; 'software,': 0.32; 'getting': 0.33; 'run': 0.33; 'source': 0.33; 'hopefully': 0.33; 'machine.': 0.33; 'windows.': 0.33; 'open': 0.33; 'tue,': 0.34; 'gives': 0.35; 'received:google.com': 0.35; 'quite': 0.35; 'something': 0.35; 'level': 0.35; 'but': 0.36; 'there': 0.36; 'received:209.85': 0.36; '(and': 0.36; 'hosted': 0.36; 'subject:: ': 0.37; 'setting': 0.37; 'say': 0.37; 'support,': 0.37; 'starting': 0.37; 'virtual': 0.38; 'received:209': 0.38; 'mean': 0.38; 'does': 0.39; 'still': 0.40; 'some': 0.40; 'software': 0.40; 'your': 0.60; 'programs': 0.62; 'different': 0.63; 'mar': 0.65; 'results': 0.66; 'money': 0.71; '*lot*': 0.84; '3.6': 0.84; 'choices:': 0.84; 'chrisa': 0.84; 'patient,': 0.84; 'presumably': 0.84; 'refuses': 0.84; 'to:none': 0.91; 'wine': 0.91 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:cc; bh=B+bIY8B+HEYcmbbPS1GDZREDkHY90Dv3R6vTXuz508k=; b=j5amb8wfE7S1Bj77gNNqkKOLWtiVufkJknzYRowYyQIYErMyNc66iMitbn4eNusjaM p5WdINknkw5p1TAnkXoKyahl8Bd5RWnPx5OKEEYns/HmmDIFOuxDT9BBtRXS7zRU4uV7 rK06ORp6+yF/a6RUD1vFCDN3ko2GbePMyH7nkVMY89g8/WPl/9PahJ6ic67wPwHU3p0q H7A9mfMvl/RQExViG2CFIyVfy+2YiWWaRB1N0t8idRThmxy6kLSVwFLDk4C27Q2SLnzT yrNRPiofnzee6uUtqqLCUlSs6W9kTcQIU0AMPgnXBaZZEXaBd8VLWnk/VNp/ixXez+Wp 4jZw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:cc; bh=B+bIY8B+HEYcmbbPS1GDZREDkHY90Dv3R6vTXuz508k=; b=VN+ufUxmKxsVsn7W8CFyotpFtg5rxFT2OC8SejB6w7oLSwb8KwSM0e7dIcONDghNvj 1vFR67r9yWTs363od8riSl6DCNC2wFLzcNmmbxUwSj++BWEkujiKFTj1uM5i4lfZdPlB kA0VJrtXemyPMmRhobln97mh8dT9AteeTO67S85ULKuz6saiF2mxyU5hW6zlLGcAbi8K kzPXBwCgSZfh+0SJQ/vj36lsywdqxoB7nttda3dAikkRfhvxfSR/9BrCpe9csnE64cG/ 7Wt/YZeBgOvP4Cmy2Ft1SoA+cN1gPsoQorxrNcFAROT2o8o7VU2qzMwsIza7BwZoGtnx ILaw== X-Gm-Message-State: AD7BkJLtWEX0tI29h6UgieKcAdk0hsjjUcK38GDlwtGZEFMphOO71p6saCoVr+8kqB3vOraw72aqwj705CsujQ== X-Received: by 10.107.47.163 with SMTP id v35mr21030251iov.19.1457380069076; Mon, 07 Mar 2016 11:47:49 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.python:104249 On Tue, Mar 8, 2016 at 5:51 AM, Jon Ribbens wrote: > I must say that Python on Windows was a very poor experience indeed, > "virtualenv" does not work and "venv" refuses to create the 'activate' > shell script so does not work either (and pygame doesn't work, but > that's presumably not Python's fault). To be quite frank, Python on Windows has had a *lot* of problems, and most of them have been the fault of Windows. Starting with Python 3.5, there've been some big packaging changes that ought to make Windows Python a bit easier to use; however, there've been some teething troubles, and there are still some ways in which setting up a properly-working Python is a pain. So you have a few choices: 1) Stick with the vanilla Python on the vanilla Windows. It's not horrendous, but there will be rough edges. Report those rough edges, and hopefully they can be fixed in time for 3.6 (or even 3.5.2). 2) Use a different Python distribution, eg Anaconda or ActiveState. Some of them cost money; when you pay money for open source software, what you're getting is a level of support, which will mean you can complain to them when something doesn't work, and insist that they fix it. This may or may not give you better results than option 1. 3) Use standard Python, and ditch Windows. This is what I do. :) 4) Keep using Windows, but do your Python work in a virtual machine. Either full-on virtualization software like VirtualBox or VMWare, or something that gives you a web browser interface to a VM hosted in the cloud (eg Cloud 9 or Nitrous). Personally, I don't see any reason to run "real Windows" on any of my systems. Windows programs get run under Wine or VirtualBox, never directly on the hardware. But if your needs are different, there are plenty of ways to improve your Windows+Python setup; just be patient, and accept that you might have a bit of extra work to do. ChrisA