Path: csiph.com!v102.xanadu-bbs.net!xanadu-bbs.net!goblin1!goblin2!goblin.stu.neva.ru!newsfeed.xs4all.nl!newsfeed4.news.xs4all.nl!xs4all!post.news.xs4all.nl!not-for-mail Return-Path: X-Original-To: python-list@python.org Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org X-Spam-Status: OK 0.017 X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 0.97; '*S*': 0.00; 'kind,': 0.05; 'reason,': 0.07; 'suddenly': 0.07; 'answering': 0.09; 'escape': 0.09; 'subject:features': 0.09; 'url:blog': 0.10; 'question.': 0.14; '"i': 0.16; 'camp': 0.16; 'eclipse': 0.16; 'keys.': 0.16; 'mode,': 0.16; 'pause': 0.16; 'rsi': 0.16; 'simpson': 0.16; 'sleep;': 0.16; 'vi.': 0.16; 'sat,': 0.16; ':-)': 0.16; 'wrote:': 0.18; 'trying': 0.19; 'slightly': 0.19; 'things.': 0.19; 'typing': 0.19; 'user.': 0.19; '8bit%:5': 0.22; 'programming': 0.22; 'faq': 0.24; 'cheers,': 0.24; 'right.': 0.26; 'this:': 0.26; 'second': 0.26; 'header:In-Reply-To:1': 0.27; '[1]': 0.29; 'am,': 0.29; 'mode': 0.30; 'nature': 0.30; 'message-id:@mail.gmail.com': 0.30; "i'm": 0.30; 'went': 0.31; 'getting': 0.31; 'file': 0.32; 'quite': 0.32; 'linux': 0.33; 'not.': 0.33; 'third': 0.33; 'device': 0.34; 'trouble': 0.34; 'could': 0.34; 'received:google.com': 0.35; 'belong': 0.36; 'choosing': 0.36; 'controls': 0.36; 'in.': 0.36; 'should': 0.36; 'operating': 0.37; 'two': 0.37; 'being': 0.38; 'skip:& 10': 0.38; 'to:addr:python-list': 0.38; 'fact': 0.38; 'that,': 0.38; 'does': 0.39; 'functional': 0.39; 'heard': 0.39; 'to:addr:python.org': 0.39; 'first': 0.61; 'complete': 0.62; 'skip:n 10': 0.64; 'subject:Important': 0.65; 'minutes': 0.67; 'dont': 0.67; 'url:me': 0.69; 'jul': 0.74; 'heavy': 0.81; 'asked.': 0.84; 'bloody': 0.84; 'keystrokes': 0.84; 'priest': 0.84; 'start!': 0.84; 'url:posts': 0.84; 'novice': 0.91; 'temple': 0.91; 'approached': 0.93; '2013': 0.98 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :content-type; bh=jx0FE26qPRMXgs6PzH/Tyle6ZNiqOGAEVNBa1gmWRM4=; b=yxr1b/ZikcQoO0ZS86vmq4NEszgi8j7tlZFsBmDzOpnS/BYN8dKKke/FnSzmdDvbRW tiaJJuE2ocJAIyZ91IlX5wxnK3o+G/icDxgbC4e0R5Oh8238d/rgvpkPSBVEHhT8pU/r nu8jz6uCa4V/bBNLeGWLVi4MNuQbNmSNKU7k5G56JTNUKIa+CYB8a+eDW1d8QgnZaxy9 DXjRMVi/15WBqsfxwPzuU5r9LbM70zOgrzGzZRTtAtBbwtse/Po+yXmxd95/ScHBpi4+ 97jYPnMYe/yGAQd576GOhxIML06H/C+ignc9dk5nlNXNI6EWoIDMXJqItOxE5e2TnfJL H7Fw== X-Received: by 10.42.32.132 with SMTP id e4mr4546878icd.118.1373080424535; Fri, 05 Jul 2013 20:13:44 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <20130705230638.GA38521@cskk.homeip.net> References: <081319f4-4d68-409e-81cb-1f500d5d87f0@googlegroups.com> <20130705230638.GA38521@cskk.homeip.net> From: Rustom Mody Date: Sat, 6 Jul 2013 08:43:24 +0530 Subject: Re: Important features for editors To: python-list@python.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=bcaec5196823f3dc6e04e0cf32e2 X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Newsgroups: comp.lang.python Message-ID: Lines: 150 NNTP-Posting-Host: 2001:888:2000:d::a6 X-Trace: 1373080433 news.xs4all.nl 15904 [2001:888:2000:d::a6]:39902 X-Complaints-To: abuse@xs4all.nl Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.python:50041 --bcaec5196823f3dc6e04e0cf32e2 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 On Sat, Jul 6, 2013 at 4:36 AM, Cameron Simpson wrote: > While I started with vi just slightly before encountering emacs > (mid-to-late 1980s, both), my main trouble with choosing emacs was > the heavy use of control keys. Vi's modal nature means that in > "edit" mode, all the keystrokes are available as edit controls. > Emacs' modeless nature means that all the edit controls must be > control-this and meta/escape-that. > > For this reason, I often expand EMACS as Escape Meta Alt Control Shift. > > Yes... The fact that rms has crippling RSI should indicate that emacs' ergonomics is not right. > I'm a vi user. Once I mastered "hit ESC by reflex when you pause > typing an insert" I was never confused above which mode I was in. > > And now my fingers know vi. > > Yes... vi: (n) A program that has two modes, one in which it beeps and the other in which it corrupts your file :-) > Cheers, > -- > Cameron Simpson > > A novice of the temple once approached the Chief Priest with a question. > > "Master, does Emacs have the Buddha nature?" the novice asked. > > The Chief Priest had been in the temple for many years and could be > relied > upon to know these things. He thought for several minutes before > replying. > > "I don't see why not. It's got bloody well everything else." > > With that, the Chief Priest went to lunch. The novice suddenly achieved > enlightenment, several years later. > > Commentary: > > His Master is kind, > Answering his FAQ quickly, > With thought and sarcasm. > > Heard somewhere: Emacs is my operating system and linux is its device driver. No I dont belong to that camp -- Actually I am quite dissatisfied with emacs nowadays... Keep trying eclipse and getting repulsed by the gorilla. Philosophy being this: What functional programming is to program-semantics, fast-branching (as in git) is to program-source[1]. To complete the trinity, one needs semi-automated refactoring. The first I can do in my sleep; the second still noob-status, the third yet to start! [1] Not necessarily source-code See http://blog.vctr.me/posts/why-you-should-learn-git.html --bcaec5196823f3dc6e04e0cf32e2 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sat, Jul 6, 2013 at 4:36 AM, Cameron Simpson <cs@zip.com.au> = wrote:
While I started with vi just slightly before encountering emacs
(mid-to-late 1980s, both), my main trouble with choosing emacs was
the heavy use of control keys. Vi's modal nature means that in
"edit" mode, all the keystrokes are available as edit controls. Emacs' modeless nature means that all the edit controls must be
control-this and meta/escape-that.

For this reason, I often expand EMACS as Escape Meta Alt Control Shift.


Yes...
The fact that rms has crippling RSI sho= uld indicate that emacs' ergonomics is not right.
=A0
I'm a vi user. Once I mastered "hit ESC by reflex when you pause typing an insert" I was never confused above which mode I was in.

And now my fingers know vi.


Yes...
vi: (n) A progr= am that has two modes, one in which it beeps and the other in which it corr= upts your file :-)
=A0
Cheers,
--
Cameron Simpson <cs@zip.com.au><= br>
A novice of the temple once approached the Chief Priest with a questi= on.

=A0 "Master, does Emacs have the Buddha nature?" the novice asked= .

=A0 The Chief Priest had been in the temple for many years and could be rel= ied
=A0 upon to know these things. =A0He thought for several minutes before rep= lying.

=A0 "I don't see why not. =A0It's got bloody well everything e= lse."

=A0 With that, the Chief Priest went to lunch. =A0The novice suddenly achie= ved
enlightenment, several years later.

Commentary:

=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 His Master is kind,
=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 Answering his FAQ quickly,
=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 With thought and sarcasm.
=

Heard somewhere: Emacs is my operating system and li= nux is its device driver.

No I dont belong to that camp -- Actually = I am quite dissatisfied with emacs nowadays... Keep trying eclipse and gett= ing repulsed by the gorilla.

Philosophy being this: What functional programming is to program-semant= ics, fast-branching (as in git) is to program-source[1].=A0 To complete the= trinity, one needs semi-automated refactoring.
The first I can do in my= sleep; the second still noob-status, the third yet to start!

[1] Not necessarily source-code See http://blog.vctr.me/posts/why-you-should-l= earn-git.html
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