Path: csiph.com!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!not-for-mail From: Laura Creighton Newsgroups: comp.lang.python Subject: Re: What is a function parameter =[] for? Date: Wed, 25 Nov 2015 01:55:51 +0100 Lines: 25 Message-ID: References: <56544BAB.9020709@rece.vub.ac.be> <874mgbpnb5.fsf@elektro.pacujo.net> <486929d1-4caa-403c-89e6-c45d7b447f98@googlegroups.com> <5655035c$0$1609$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de TsF50u5TLEb2QDFMSQirJwTOewa/GJIi1v9UDnJPQrng== Return-Path: X-Original-To: python-list@python.org Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org X-Spam-Status: OK 0.003 X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 0.99; '*S*': 0.00; 'cc:addr:python-list': 0.09; 'agrees': 0.09; 'received:openend.se': 0.09; 'received:theraft.openend.se': 0.09; 'python': 0.10; 'wed,': 0.15; 'bound.': 0.16; 'cc:addr:lac': 0.16; 'cc:addr:openend.se': 0.16; 'correctly,': 0.16; 'from:addr:lac': 0.16; 'from:addr:openend.se': 0.16; 'from:name:laura creighton': 0.16; 'message- id:@fido.openend.se': 0.16; 'received:fido': 0.16; 'received:fido.openend.se': 0.16; 'received:io': 0.16; 'received:psf.io': 0.16; 'to:addr:pearwood.info': 0.16; "to:name:steven d'aprano": 0.16; 'laura': 0.18; '2015': 0.20; 'cc:addr:python.org': 0.20; 'cc:2**1': 0.22; 'not,': 0.22; 'saying': 0.22; '(or': 0.23; 'words': 0.24; 'values': 0.28; 'received:se': 0.29; 'thinks': 0.29; 'cc:no real name:2**1': 0.29; 'work.': 0.30; 'instead,': 0.33; 'word.': 0.33; 'list': 0.34; 'next': 0.35; 'done': 0.35; 'clear': 0.35; 'nov': 0.35; 'but': 0.36; 'there': 0.36; 'subject:?': 0.36; 'subject:: ': 0.37; 'charset:us-ascii': 0.37; 'things': 0.38; 'mean': 0.38; 'sure': 0.39; 'term': 0.60; 'header:Message-Id:1': 0.61; 'back': 0.62; 'different': 0.63; 'funny': 0.83; 'clarity.': 0.84; 'header:In- reply-to:1': 0.84; 'cutting': 0.93 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=openend.se; s=default; t=1448412954; bh=UTgsmCfsDpRnc6VDcUCKhb1q6nTJk1L5RaK/+kxSZrM=; h=To:cc:From:Subject:In-reply-to:References:Date:From; b=UbokI72oqqM+Kk9xVT7X0kcas3bezWe17m1POHfdciODqJH5P14QZ0hYcdBd7F0rS qGB87R7wnWxqnTxIG1zNJuHfo8WvgkPeScWabj0/7d1Y2Cb5QSg/s0MpA1YN27zfrs YTAgULo7Z/ZVH2HwJgKdj1u97n0X86MCI56SOuuA= In-reply-to: <5655035c$0$1609$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> Comments: In-reply-to "Steven D'Aprano" message dated "Wed, 25 Nov 2015 11:39:54 +1100." Content-ID: <5887.1448412951.1@fido> X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.3.9 (theraft.openend.se [82.96.5.2]); Wed, 25 Nov 2015 01:55:54 +0100 (CET) X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20+ Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.python:99407 In a message of Wed, 25 Nov 2015 11:39:54 +1100, "Steven D'Aprano" writes: >I'm not sure what value [ha, see what I did there?!] there is in inventing >two new words for things that we already have standard terms for. Done correctly, you can get clarity. >"Referent" is just a funny way of saying "object", and "evalue" is just a >misspelling of "value". If I had a time machine, I would go back to early days of Python and ban the use of the term 'assignment' and 'value' both. I would insist that the term 'binding' be used instead, though if you want to use the verb refer, to be synonymous with bind, well, I think that would work. (If not, next trip with the time machine, I ban that one as well.) Then you make it perfectly clear that what are bound are _objects_ not values (or evalues). The object has an evalue, but it is the object that is bound. It is crystal clear than people on this list mean very different things when they use the term 'value', and every one of them thinks that Python agrees with them. Cutting this knot may require a new word. Laura