Path: csiph.com!usenet.pasdenom.info!news.redatomik.org!newsfeed.xs4all.nl!newsfeed1a.news.xs4all.nl!xs4all!newsgate.cistron.nl!newsgate.news.xs4all.nl!post.news.xs4all.nl!not-for-mail Return-Path: X-Original-To: python-list@python.org Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org X-Spam-Status: OK 0.005 X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 0.99; '*S*': 0.00; 'from:addr:yahoo.co.uk': 0.04; 'url:pipermail': 0.05; 'subject:Python': 0.06; 'string': 0.09; 'lawrence': 0.09; 'received:80.91': 0.09; 'received:80.91.229': 0.09; 'received:gmane.org': 0.09; 'received:list': 0.09; 'subject:skip:c 10': 0.09; 'python': 0.11; 'language.': 0.14; "(i'll": 0.16; 'acm': 0.16; 'int)': 0.16; 'received:80.91.229.3': 0.16; 'received:plane.gmane.org': 0.16; 'stderr': 0.16; 'subject: \n ': 0.16; 'subject:between': 0.16; 'subject:programming': 0.16; 'switches': 0.16; 'essential': 0.16; 'language': 0.16; 'wrote:': 0.18; 'saying': 0.22; 'header:User- Agent:1': 0.23; 'rid': 0.24; 'header:X-Complaints-To:1': 0.27; 'header:In-Reply-To:1': 0.27; 'idea': 0.28; 'leave': 0.29; '[1]': 0.29; "i'm": 0.30; 'dropped': 0.31; 'noted': 0.31; 'subject:that': 0.31; 'universal': 0.31; 'probably': 0.32; 'figure': 0.32; 'url:python': 0.33; 'guess': 0.33; "i'd": 0.34; "can't": 0.35; 'computing': 0.35; 'but': 0.35; 'there': 0.35; 'right?': 0.36; 'subject:?': 0.36; 'url:org': 0.36; 'should': 0.36; 'members.': 0.37; 'two': 0.37; 'handle': 0.38; 'to:addr:python-list': 0.38; 'does': 0.39; '12,': 0.39; 'to:addr:python.org': 0.39; 'received:org': 0.40; 'url:mail': 0.40; 'how': 0.40; 'making': 0.63; 'hear': 0.63; 'kind': 0.63; 'real': 0.63; 'our': 0.64; 'more': 0.64; 'chance': 0.65; 'charset:windows-1252': 0.65; 'within': 0.65; 'world': 0.66; 'receive': 0.70; 'gotten': 0.74; '2.8': 0.84; '2015': 0.84; 'lights,': 0.84; 'subject: *': 0.84; 'subject:Good': 0.91 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ To: python-list@python.org From: Mark Lawrence Subject: Re: Instead of deciding between Python or Lisp for a programming intro course...What about an intro course that uses *BOTH*? Good idea? Date: Tue, 12 May 2015 19:22:33 +0100 References: <02dba7aa-8466-4937-a8d8-82ffd03e5568@googlegroups.com> <87wq0gyvyr.fsf@elektro.pacujo.net> <55515f9d$0$12987$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <60c01c07-aef9-4232-92cd-22e6c017fc9c@googlegroups.com> <4628bce6-98d5-44b7-bb3b-bcb796c0df77@googlegroups.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: host-78-147-185-107.as13285.net User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.3; WOW64; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/31.6.0 In-Reply-To: X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20+ Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Newsgroups: comp.lang.python Message-ID: Lines: 34 NNTP-Posting-Host: 2001:888:2000:d::a6 X-Trace: 1431454962 news.xs4all.nl 2957 [2001:888:2000:d::a6]:40465 X-Complaints-To: abuse@xs4all.nl Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.python:90476 On 12/05/2015 18:35, Rustom Mody wrote: > On Tuesday, May 12, 2015 at 8:48:13 PM UTC+5:30, zipher wrote: >> >> I/O is an essential part of computing in the West. (I'll leave Symbolics out of of that category.) It started with switches and lights, so what kind of bullshit is saying that you should get rid of PRINT? ACM must have gotten confused or steamrolled by one of its members. > > In the West? WEST?? > Did I hear that right? > I prefer this[1] Each object has to figure out how it will receive things from outside of it. Things it can't handle (a string sent to an int) just have to be dropped to some other space, much like stderr does within the O.S. There are probably many other very interesting examples, but the key idea I'm working on (as noted in other messages), is a sort-of universal language for the internet, a WebOS to be applied to a universal data model. I'd guess that the concept is in the same boat as Python 2.8 or RickedPython, but I suspect that these two have far more chance of making it into the real world than "a sort-of universal language for the internet, a WebOS to be applied to a universal data model" [1]https://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-ideas/2013-March/019979.html -- My fellow Pythonistas, ask not what our language can do for you, ask what you can do for our language. Mark Lawrence