Path: csiph.com!usenet.pasdenom.info!news.albasani.net!newsfeed.freenet.ag!news2.euro.net!newsgate.cistron.nl!newsgate.news.xs4all.nl!post.news.xs4all.nl!not-for-mail Return-Path: X-Original-To: python-list@python.org Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org X-Spam-Status: OK 0.027 X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 0.95; '*S*': 0.00; ';-)': 0.03; 'argument': 0.05; 'subject:PEP': 0.07; 'variables': 0.07; 'arguments': 0.09; 'exit': 0.09; 'statements': 0.09; 'cc:addr:python-list': 0.11; '1998': 0.16; 'ah!': 0.16; 'factory,': 0.16; 'jumping': 0.16; 'personally,': 0.16; 'sorts': 0.16; 'specific,': 0.16; 'such,': 0.16; 'think?': 0.16; 'wing': 0.16; 'wrote:': 0.18; 'module': 0.19; 'passing': 0.19; 'seems': 0.21; 'cc:addr:python.org': 0.22; 'header:User-Agent:1': 0.23; 'adds': 0.24; 'cc:2**0': 0.24; 'cc:no real name:2**0': 0.24; "i've": 0.25; 'header:In-Reply-To:1': 0.27; 'function': 0.29; 'am,': 0.29; 'cool': 0.30; 'code': 0.31; '25,': 0.31; 'ray': 0.31; 'religious': 0.31; 'allows': 0.31; 'checked': 0.32; 'regular': 0.32; 'run': 0.32; 'another': 0.32; 'guess': 0.33; 'knows': 0.35; 'objects': 0.35; 'but': 0.35; 'there': 0.35; 'programming,': 0.36; 'entry': 0.36; 'should': 0.36; 'two': 0.37; 'checks': 0.38; 'bill': 0.39; 'itself': 0.39; 'called': 0.40; 'space': 0.40; 'how': 0.40; '2nd': 0.60; 'ian': 0.60; 'subject:? ': 0.60; 'first': 0.61; 'kind': 0.63; 'provide': 0.64; 'occur': 0.65; 'header:Reply-To:1': 0.67; '26,': 0.68; 'caused': 0.69; 'reply-to:no real name:2**0': 0.71; 'william': 0.81; 'subject:this': 0.83; '"one': 0.84; 'actually,': 0.84; 'goto': 0.84; 'received:89': 0.85; '2013,': 0.91; 'trouble.': 0.91; 'to:none': 0.92; '2013': 0.98 Date: Wed, 26 Jun 2013 23:11:21 +0300 From: Jan Riechers User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; rv:17.0) Gecko/20130509 Thunderbird/17.0.6 MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: python-list@python.org Subject: Re: Is this PEP-able? fwhile References: <8D03FD9C062D3C9-1864-1CD1D@webmail-m103.sysops.aol.com> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list Reply-To: janpeterr@freenet.de List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Newsgroups: comp.lang.python Message-ID: Lines: 65 NNTP-Posting-Host: 2001:888:2000:d::a6 X-Trace: 1372279248 news.xs4all.nl 15864 [2001:888:2000:d::a6]:41440 X-Complaints-To: abuse@xs4all.nl Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.python:49278 On 26.06.2013 16:28, William Ray Wing wrote: > On Jun 26, 2013, at 7:49 AM, Fábio Santos > wrote: >> >> On 26 Jun 2013 11:45, > wrote: >> > >> > On Tuesday, June 25, 2013 9:30:54 PM UTC+5:30, Ian wrote: >> > > In my experience the sorts of people who preach "one exit point" are >> > > also all about defining preconditions and postconditions and proving >> > > that the postconditions follow from the preconditions. I think that >> > > the two are linked, because the "one exit point" rule makes those >> > > sorts of proofs simpler. >> > >> > Ah! utopia! >> > >> > For every one who knows about pre/post/invariant conditions, there >> are 10 who follow goto-statement-is-harmful like a religious edict. >> > >> > >> > >> > I just checked and MISRA-C 2012 now allows gotos in specific, >> limited circumstances. I think it was the MISRA-C 1998 standard that >> caused all this trouble. So if MISRA now allows goto, why not >> Python???? :) >> > >> >> What is the matter? Just use the goto module... >> >> > > Wondered when that would be mentioned. > > Personally, I've never found that much use for GoTo, but as old timers > know, that same module adds the Come_From entry point, which is > priceless. ;-) > > Bill > > Actually, jumping to any place a program (I know it from QBasic :) ) is some kind of voodoo. At first it seems that any function calling itself or calling another function from another function solves the "goto" puzzle - called OO programming, objects in space and inheritance? But at 2nd glimpse, jumping in any place of code (function) or routine, at a given place precisely - and to avoid any checks and unrelated code which might occur on a regular function call and without the need to provide additional arguments - that's kinda cool (if variables are in scope by the target statements :) ) That's somehow how I remember it. But I guess if everything should run as in a factory, one entrance, one component, one result and independently from each other (isolated) and on many cores and such, a goto without argument passing or state variables might just end up in a big mess. What do you think?