Path: csiph.com!x330-a1.tempe.blueboxinc.net!usenet.pasdenom.info!weretis.net!feeder1.news.weretis.net!feeder.erje.net!newsfeed.xs4all.nl!newsfeed6.news.xs4all.nl!xs4all!post.news.xs4all.nl!not-for-mail
Return-Path: <ethan@stoneleaf.us>
X-Original-To: python-list@python.org
Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org
X-Spam-Status: OK 0.000
X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 1.00; '*S*': 0.00; 'python,': 0.01; 'extracted': 0.05; 'terry': 0.07; 'wrapper': 0.07; 'python': 0.08; 'callable': 0.09; 'from:addr:ethan': 0.09; 'from:addr:stoneleaf.us': 0.09; 'from:name:ethan furman': 0.09; 'function:': 0.09; 'message-id:@stoneleaf.us': 0.09; 'method:': 0.09; 'received:gator410.hostgator.com': 0.09; '~ethan~': 0.09; 'am,': 0.12; 'method.': 0.15; '(note:': 0.16; 'received:72.11': 0.16; 'received:72.11.125': 0.16; 'received:72.11.125.166': 0.16; 'reedy': 0.16; 'unbound': 0.16; 'looked': 0.16; 'meant': 0.17; 'wrote:': 0.18; 'instance': 0.18; 'dec': 0.22; 'header:In-Reply- To:1': 0.22; 'code': 0.25; 'function': 0.27; 'missed': 0.28; 'subject:" ': 0.28; 'indicated': 0.29; 'worked': 0.29; 'class': 0.29; 'correct': 0.29; 'usually': 0.31; 'does': 0.32; 'thu,': 0.32; 'header:User-Agent:1': 0.33; 'agree': 0.33; 'object': 0.33; 'to:addr:python-list': 0.34; 'skip:h 40': 0.34; 'subject:with': 0.36; 'cc:2**1': 0.36; 'bound': 0.37; 'two': 0.37; 'think': 0.37; 'steven': 0.38; 'help': 0.39; 'subject: (': 0.40; 'to:addr:python.org': 0.40; '2011': 0.61; 'matter': 0.61; 'your': 0.61; 'lives': 0.63; 'our': 0.64; 'received:websitewelcome.com': 0.64; 'here': 0.65; 'received:184': 0.67; 'supply': 0.69; '-0500,': 0.84; 'disagreement': 0.84; 'entry,': 0.84
Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2011 15:26:30 -0800
From: Ethan Furman <ethan@stoneleaf.us>
User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.10 (Windows/20070221)
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: python-list@python.org
Subject: Re: AttributeError in "with" statement (3.2.2)
References: <b8092181-c306-40bc-a07a-bb35bc925cf1@18g2000prn.googlegroups.com>	<CALFfu7BwozUsp=WB1+66wH9RR1=DQCAprNve7N+LFR2ptGMFWg@mail.gmail.com>	<mailman.3626.1323844169.27778.python-list@python.org>	<4ee857d4$0$11091$c3e8da3@news.astraweb.com>	<mailman.3659.1323904439.27778.python-list@python.org>	<4ee97f20$0$11091$c3e8da3@news.astraweb.com>	<mailman.3707.1323995986.27778.python-list@python.org>	<4eeb0ddb$0$29979$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <jcgfce$cb8$1@dough.gmane.org>
In-Reply-To: <jcgfce$cb8$1@dough.gmane.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report
X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - gator410.hostgator.com
X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - python.org
X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12]
X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - stoneleaf.us
X-BWhitelist: no
X-Source: 
X-Source-Args: 
X-Source-Dir: 
X-Source-Sender: mail.admailinc.com ([192.168.10.136]) [72.11.125.166]:4385
X-Source-Auth: ethan+stoneleaf.us
X-Email-Count: 3
X-Source-Cap: dG9idWs7dG9idWs7Z2F0b3I0MTAuaG9zdGdhdG9yLmNvbQ==
Cc: Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info>, Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu>
X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12
Precedence: list
List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language <python-list.python.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-list>, <mailto:python-list-request@python.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-list>
List-Post: <mailto:python-list@python.org>
List-Help: <mailto:python-list-request@python.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list>, <mailto:python-list-request@python.org?subject=subscribe>
Newsgroups: comp.lang.python
Message-ID: <mailman.3758.1324079477.27778.python-list@python.org>
Lines: 41
NNTP-Posting-Host: 2001:888:2000:d::a6
X-Trace: 1324079477 news.xs4all.nl 6932 [2001:888:2000:d::a6]:54835
X-Complaints-To: abuse@xs4all.nl
Xref: x330-a1.tempe.blueboxinc.net comp.lang.python:17393

Terry Reedy wrote:
> On 12/16/2011 4:22 AM, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
>> On Thu, 15 Dec 2011 19:39:17 -0500, Terry Reedy wrote:
>> [...]
>>
>> After reading your post, I think I have worked out where our disagreement
>> lies: you think that bound methods and instance methods are not the same
>> thing,
> 
> Do you agree that an unbound method and a bound method are different? In 
> Python, as indicated by the glossary entry, an unspecified 'method' is 
> usually meant to be an unbound method. 

I think you two are in violent agreement as far as how Python is 
functioning, and the conflict is in the names given to the various 
pieces... I think a glossary would help (please correct me):

function:  callable code suite

method:  function that lives in a class

unbound method:  function that lives in a class

bound method:  callable wrapper around function that has been extracted 
from class that will supply the instance object to the function (note: 
Python does not save these, they are recreated at each lookup)


and here is where I think you two diverge:

instance method (Steven):  a bound method that has been saved into the 
instance __dict__ (no matter how created)

instance method (Terry):  a function that must be looked up in the class


Have I missed anything?

Honestly-trying-learn-the-distinctions-ly yours,

~Ethan~