Path: csiph.com!v102.xanadu-bbs.net!xanadu-bbs.net!news.glorb.com!news2.euro.net!newsgate.cistron.nl!newsgate.news.xs4all.nl!post.news.xs4all.nl!not-for-mail
Return-Path: <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com>
X-Original-To: python-list@python.org
Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org
X-Spam-Status: OK 0.054
X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 0.91; '*S*': 0.02; 'programmer': 0.03; 'badly': 0.09; 'name?': 0.09; 'oop': 0.09; 'python': 0.11; 'mostly': 0.14; 'useful,': 0.14; '23,': 0.16; 'inaccurate': 0.16; 'prohibit': 0.16; 'subject:object': 0.16; 'language': 0.16; 'wrote:': 0.18; 'saying': 0.22; 'developers': 0.25; 'post': 0.26; 'header:In-Reply-To:1': 0.27; 'feature': 0.29; 'am,': 0.29; 'message-id:@mail.gmail.com': 0.30; "i'm": 0.30; "d'aprano": 0.31; 'steven': 0.31; 'languages': 0.32; 'subject:the': 0.34; 'created': 0.35; 'received:google.com': 0.35; 'somebody': 0.38; 'to:addr :python-list': 0.38; 'does': 0.39; 'to:addr:python.org': 0.39; 'skip:u 10': 0.60; 'ian': 0.60; 'most': 0.60; 'simply': 0.61; 'advanced': 0.63; 'around,': 0.84; 'completely,': 0.84; 'expose': 0.84; 'instantly': 0.84; 'inheritance,': 0.93; 'relating': 0.93; '2013': 0.98
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :content-type; bh=aoI3XJ5bHaek3chVibjsTb8b4tZoeJr79xTkPoaTgH4=; b=xVbm7gT6WB54LIuuhucPMdr62yoESrHS4WACHJ9bSZGyL70FUMCyIdxKIq+H3EdERu Xszg3b4uvySbULMGL3zALqh3MX2BVWfpJAbpE8EnvnBgSnUEeBJrVNXiB2e4VTwNCa1K GcYyU9kdJ9BgVE7HKV6cxPF4cL0A3mdL2+m0/b+SNy6hDEb5jdDNg/HPMPZH2kFkllKx zdiP55wBJIs+83/rMAaAtTAzRFhe5T5AzRSLNA5VqzO8gIm5ffvI0Zdt1N+o+CFUe4Qp 8+NzpzVCGs2uKjckXxLHrERrByRQKBrGbQW7qc9OYPkcyo0Qdnj9hfh7qtfQ8vxm5bou 0gjg==
X-Received: by 10.68.218.8 with SMTP id pc8mr20375093pbc.115.1372010716161; Sun, 23 Jun 2013 11:05:16 -0700 (PDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <51c73229$0$29999$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com>
References: <15ba0011-bbf1-42f7-b3ea-1c1d4b70e56b@googlegroups.com> <51c66962$0$29999$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <20130623133546.GA2308@capricorn> <mailman.3729.1372004188.3114.python-list@python.org> <51c723b4$0$29999$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <roy-4289AA.12494223062013@70-1-84-166.pools.spcsdns.net> <CALwzid=FVJyWQ7WbqpQe_MOVCe3NERC0=JRqxTFxQT-+-4nPCA@mail.gmail.com> <mailman.3731.1372007973.3114.python-list@python.org> <51c73229$0$29999$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com>
From: Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com>
Date: Sun, 23 Jun 2013 12:04:35 -0600
Subject: Re: What is the semantics meaning of 'object'?
To: Python <python-list@python.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15
Precedence: list
List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language <python-list.python.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-list>, <mailto:python-list-request@python.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-list/>
List-Post: <mailto:python-list@python.org>
List-Help: <mailto:python-list-request@python.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list>, <mailto:python-list-request@python.org?subject=subscribe>
Newsgroups: comp.lang.python
Message-ID: <mailman.3732.1372010720.3114.python-list@python.org>
Lines: 19
NNTP-Posting-Host: 2001:888:2000:d::a6
X-Trace: 1372010720 news.xs4all.nl 15944 [2001:888:2000:d::a6]:39185
X-Complaints-To: abuse@xs4all.nl
Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.python:48996

On Sun, Jun 23, 2013 at 11:36 AM, Steven D'Aprano
<steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> wrote:
> On Sun, 23 Jun 2013 11:18:41 -0600, Ian Kelly wrote:
>
>> Incidentally, although super() is useful, it's not perfect, and this is
>> one of my grievances with it: that a user can, based upon the name, draw
>> an inaccurate assumption about what it does without reading or fully
>> understanding the documentation on it, which might then result in
>> misusing it.
>
> Wait a second... are you saying that the Python developers created an
> advanced language feature relating to multiple inheritance, one of the
> most complex OOP concepts around, so difficult that most other languages
> simply prohibit it completely, and it wasn't instantly and correctly
> intuited by every single programmer based only on the name? Oh my stars,
> somebody call Ranting Rick, he needs to write a PyWart post to expose
> this scandal!!!

Mostly I'm saying that super() is badly named.