Path: csiph.com!usenet.pasdenom.info!gegeweb.org!de-l.enfer-du-nord.net!feeder1.enfer-du-nord.net!feeds.phibee-telecom.net!newsfeed.xs4all.nl!newsfeed6.news.xs4all.nl!xs4all!post.news.xs4all.nl!not-for-mail Return-Path: X-Original-To: python-list@python.org Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org X-Spam-Status: OK 0.000 X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 1.00; '*S*': 0.00; 'exception': 0.03; 'case.': 0.05; 'things.': 0.05; 'arguments': 0.07; 'exception.': 0.07; 'subject:skip:c 10': 0.07; '"can\'t': 0.09; 'called.': 0.09; 'does,': 0.09; 'input,': 0.09; 'ioerror': 0.09; 'runs,': 0.09; 'cc:addr:python-list': 0.10; 'programmer': 0.11; "wouldn't": 0.11; 'times,': 0.13; 'file,': 0.15; '"assert"': 0.16; '-tkc': 0.16; 'cares': 0.16; 'from:addr:python.list': 0.16; 'from:addr:tim.thechases.com': 0.16; 'from:name:tim chase': 0.16; 'message-id:@tim.thechases.com': 0.16; 'programmer,': 0.16; 'received:70.251': 0.16; 'received:dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net': 0.16; 'received:rcsntx.swbell.net': 0.16; 'received:swbell.net': 0.16; 'run.': 0.16; 'such,': 0.16; 'suggesting': 0.16; 'to:addr:pearwood.info': 0.16; 'to:addr:steve+comp.lang.python': 0.16; "to:name:steven d'aprano": 0.16; 'violated': 0.16; 'wrote:': 0.17; 'appropriate': 0.20; 'mostly': 0.20; 'exceptions': 0.22; 'fixing': 0.22; "i'd": 0.22; 'cc:2**0': 0.23; "i've": 0.23; 'raise': 0.24; 'cc:no real name:2**0': 0.24; 'testing': 0.24; 'cc:addr:python.org': 0.25; 'header:In-Reply-To:1': 0.25; 'header :User-Agent:1': 0.26; 'possibly': 0.27; 'meeting': 0.27; 'assert': 0.29; "d'aprano": 0.29; 'leaves': 0.29; 'steven': 0.29; 'function': 0.30; 'code': 0.31; 'gets': 0.32; 'you?': 0.32; 'not.': 0.32; 'raising': 0.33; 'subject:List': 0.33; "can't": 0.34; 'wrong': 0.34; 'done': 0.34; 'sometimes': 0.35; 'something': 0.35; 'next': 0.35; 'really': 0.36; 'but': 0.36; 'depends': 0.36; 'test': 0.36; 'two': 0.37; 'why': 0.37; 'skip:z 10': 0.37; 'data': 0.37; 'subject:: ': 0.38; 'things': 0.38; 'think': 0.40; 'your': 0.60; 'easy': 0.60; 'skip:u 10': 0.60; 'more': 0.63; 'treat': 0.65; 'direct': 0.69; 'guaranteed': 0.76; 'satisfied': 0.83; '"hey,': 0.84; 'etc),': 0.84; 'grave': 0.84; 'received:50.22': 0.84; 'rolls': 0.84 Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2012 18:21:32 -0600 From: Tim Chase User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux x86_64; en-US; rv:1.9.2.24) Gecko/20111120 Icedove/3.1.16 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Steven D'Aprano Subject: Re: List comprehension for testing **params References: <50a0258f$0$21241$ba4acef3@reader.news.orange.fr> <50a03233$0$21756$c3e8da3$76491128@news.astraweb.com> In-Reply-To: <50a03233$0$21756$c3e8da3$76491128@news.astraweb.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - boston.accountservergroup.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - python.org X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - tim.thechases.com Cc: python-list@python.org X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Newsgroups: comp.lang.python Message-ID: Lines: 38 NNTP-Posting-Host: 2001:888:2000:d::a6 X-Trace: 1352679641 news.xs4all.nl 6900 [2001:888:2000:d::a6]:53839 X-Complaints-To: abuse@xs4all.nl Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.python:33152 On 11/11/12 17:18, Steven D'Aprano wrote: > but that leaves you with the next two problems: > > 2) Fixing the assert still leaves you with the wrong exception. You > wouldn't raise a ZeroDivisionError, or a UnicodeDecodeError, or an IOError > would you? No of course not. So why are you suggesting raising an > AssertionError? That is completely inappropriate, the right exception to > use is TypeError. Don't be lazy and treat assert as a quick and easy way > to get exceptions for free. I'd say that it depends on whether the dictionary/kwargs gets populated from user-supplied data (whether mail, a file, direct input, etc), or whether it's coder-supplied. I like to think of "assert" as a "hey, you bone-headed programmer, you did something that violated conditions for using this code properly!" and as such, entirely appropriate to use in the coder-supplied case. This rolls into... > 3) Asserts are not guaranteed to run. Never, never, never use assert to > test function arguments supplied by the caller, because you have no > control over whether or not the asserts will even be called. where, once the programmer is satisfied that the code runs, meeting all the appropriate tests/assertions, the assertions can then be turned off (if one really cares that much; can't say I've done it more than a couple times, mostly out of experimentation/testing to see if it made any grave difference in performance). I think you intend this in your > Or for testing things which "can't possibly fail". But of > course, since what can't go wrong does, you sometimes still want > to test things. -tkc