Path: csiph.com!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!not-for-mail From: Chris Angelico Newsgroups: comp.lang.python Subject: Re: raise None Date: Mon, 4 Jan 2016 14:56:45 +1100 Lines: 30 Message-ID: References: <56847239$0$1590$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <5684842a$0$1596$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <5684aa1a$0$1602$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <56854b49$0$1615$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <5c824139-510c-4afd-814a-03355187fa3f@googlegroups.com> <5689eb94$0$1584$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de 6rh0/zvUm/bOtJvrjaiHlQ8aC/Zmt1bZd8IDUDq5m6og== Return-Path: X-Original-To: python-list@python.org Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org X-Spam-Status: OK 0.005 X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 0.99; '*S*': 0.00; 'received:209.85.223': 0.03; 'bits': 0.07; 'cc:addr:python-list': 0.09; 'subject:None': 0.09; 'tends': 0.09; 'jan': 0.11; ':-)': 0.12; 'question.': 0.13; 'thursday,': 0.13; 'ignore': 0.14; '2016': 0.16; 'from:addr:rosuav': 0.16; 'from:name:chris angelico': 0.16; 'received:209.85.223.173': 0.16; 'received:io': 0.16; 'received:psf.io': 0.16; 'tracebacks': 0.16; 'wrote:': 0.16; 'debugging': 0.18; 'language': 0.19; '>>>': 0.20; '2015': 0.20; 'cc:2**0': 0.20; 'cc:addr:python.org': 0.20; 'issue.': 0.20; 'suggested': 0.20; '31,': 0.22; 'code,': 0.23; 'decide': 0.23; 'header:In-Reply-To:1': 0.24; 'mon,': 0.24; 'chris': 0.26; 'message-id:@mail.gmail.com': 0.27; 'pieces': 0.27; 'tutorial': 0.29; 'december': 0.32; "d'aprano": 0.33; 'faq': 0.33; 'steven': 0.33; 'received:google.com': 0.35; 'python.org': 0.35; 'could': 0.35; 'important.': 0.35; 'something': 0.35; 'but': 0.36; 'too': 0.36; 'received:209.85': 0.36; 'pm,': 0.36; 'subject:: ': 0.37; 'really': 0.37; 'two': 0.37; 'being': 0.37; 'received:209': 0.38; 'sure': 0.39; 'enough': 0.39; 'where': 0.40; 'some': 0.40; 'information,': 0.61; 'real': 0.62; 'more': 0.63; 'information': 0.63; 'series': 0.65; 'believe': 0.66; 'beautiful': 0.66; 'here': 0.66; 'chrisa': 0.84; 'utc+5:30,': 0.84; 'to:none': 0.91; 'info,': 0.93; 'technique': 0.93 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:cc :content-type; bh=5qGQT48CxZgf6l2LfiANCtrtKdOYWFDuC7iIn3Qc3GQ=; b=A6KWD7p6KOaYH581UbOCWwazJt8Lr6vkMQ1LQznTFBIZDi3NHx71IM+OO4RU0QZslN zOR/bZK8Ye3EtyrF5j7POV5dDucpWkg8jxESDyjf2U36PyVwRLEUw7dUJwbSp46YRevc UYy6riymzsLQN4BwaKEAYCa5xAQFTPFtXQKoo97DJyCn/F5lJBwM4m0ir15xDrfM+K2H cFq/NQD+H9eDAaf4hUjASdFj7C0RHKNsTeCF7DUMvG5u72p4jhhnTXosRrhU06vWGIAh 9Q1f1E5WF5OSb7ihrnYwX53jFgrAt1RFP+macem5tr2GH0ZfPjD36peuzgn0sd7Nx9xG dTjg== X-Received: by 10.107.40.76 with SMTP id o73mr18078011ioo.157.1451879805734; Sun, 03 Jan 2016 19:56:45 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <5689eb94$0$1584$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20+ Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.python:101228 On Mon, Jan 4, 2016 at 2:48 PM, Steven D'Aprano wrote: > On Mon, 4 Jan 2016 02:31 pm, Chris Angelico wrote: > >> On Mon, Jan 4, 2016 at 2:04 PM, Rustom Mody wrote: >>> On Thursday, December 31, 2015 at 9:05:58 PM UTC+5:30, Steven D'Aprano >>> wrote: >>>> But I think it is a real issue. I believe in beautiful tracebacks that >>>> give you just the right amount of information, neither too little nor >>>> two much. Debugging is hard enough with being given more information >>>> than you need and having to decide what bits to ignore and which are >>>> important. >>> >>> >>> It would be nice if the tutorial (FAQ? Lang-Ref??) had a section on how >>> to wade tracebacks >> >> Hmm, I don't think that's a language reference question. It's more >> something that I would put into a series of blog posts. > > Or the tutorial, like Rustom suggested :-) Not sure it really belongs there; the tutorial tends to keep to short and un-nested pieces of code, where this kind of technique really comes into its own with dozen-line tracebacks. The FAQ could have a link to it, but honestly, the best python.org place I can think of is the wiki. It's not something that has a single straight-forward answer; it's "when you're staring at this much info, here are some ideas for boiling it down to what matters". ChrisA