Path: csiph.com!usenet.pasdenom.info!news.alphanet.ch!alphanet.ch!news.imp.ch!newsreader4.netcologne.de!news.netcologne.de!feeds.phibee-telecom.net!newsfeed.xs4all.nl!newsfeed3.news.xs4all.nl!xs4all!post.news.xs4all.nl!not-for-mail Return-Path: X-Original-To: python-list@python.org Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org X-Spam-Status: OK 0.006 X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 0.99; '*S*': 0.00; 'anyway.': 0.05; 'encoding': 0.05; 'string.': 0.05; 'string': 0.09; 'ascii': 0.09; 'bytes.': 0.09; 'subject:design': 0.09; '16-bit': 0.16; 'janssen': 0.16; 'subject:Language': 0.16; 'unicode,': 0.16; 'unicode.': 0.16; 'all.': 0.16; 'wrote:': 0.18; 'wed,': 0.18; "python's": 0.19; 'things.': 0.19; 'to:name:python-list@python.org': 0.22; 'byte': 0.24; 'bytes': 0.24; 'unicode': 0.24; 'defined': 0.27; 'header:In-Reply-To:1': 0.27; 'function': 0.29; 'character': 0.29; 'message-id:@mail.gmail.com': 0.30; 'sep': 0.31; 'class': 0.32; 'received:74.125.82': 0.34; 'no,': 0.35; 'received:google.com': 0.35; 'sequence': 0.36; 'method': 0.36; 'similar': 0.36; 'turn': 0.37; 'list': 0.37; 'to:addr:python-list': 0.38; 'pm,': 0.38; 'received:74.125': 0.39; 'to:addr:python.org': 0.39; 'most': 0.60; "you're": 0.61; 'such': 0.63; 'map': 0.64; 'more': 0.64; 'series': 0.66; 'computers': 0.72; 'characters,': 0.84; '2013': 0.98 X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:content-type; bh=j5ye8E+uwPRfcLP6Lgmbt3/iRW8FsX4Omemfcg68ZfE=; b=c17xI1ok3F3hSfqW3qLmVoB7CwiuGG5rUIB3P7Jd78TSPmTiP+9ooKmDYbKBiyZS5d JB7ad704gT38tCfjQN/9IuF5n8exQYWTxyuriYSCRiCPfrZi21EU30ajf9+rhUaOTUjE 6v6a7ceX2utG5FTjDz5cVlY1oH0YU8k2Q1wd1QSrkXSx/2z6uD4Q7q6VRuqko4dH/fn4 W3XBS2nclddJaLf6hjJB/MMRmOLiXXe3FWV7ejopZgCzRl1bJKoIv3uSPWf+HHF0tdkN PDap3Vj4kaI8FGeY0e1Td9QUApvCnL0K3jE+QMcuguVtkV3ndO/m9EIhxtv7VCCRAkfU EPiQ== X-Gm-Message-State: ALoCoQnhGXovY7kASqrrkFb9S8+uwa7TUGg4ldIFmarAAE+baZLYU8icg3NDEOZ9srE/gwO6O/qGpBcDUuBkJKeHxnmxXA5i8HTw3qUj/3UHxzcAGuB1YM4SX0OH9ZXnJFKKbi4KNG5QFCM+6N0cqk2S6j07Wht1mw== X-Received: by 10.180.185.10 with SMTP id ey10mr3550074wic.29.1378947293343; Wed, 11 Sep 2013 17:54:53 -0700 (PDT) X-Received: by 10.180.185.10 with SMTP id ey10mr3550073wic.29.1378947293278; Wed, 11 Sep 2013 17:54:53 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: References: <522eb795$0$29999$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <7wbo412m02.fsf@benfinney.id.au> <7w38pb2ble.fsf@benfinney.id.au> From: Benjamin Kaplan Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 17:54:33 -0700 Subject: Re: Language design To: "python-list@python.org" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 X-Junkmail-Whitelist: YES (by domain whitelist at mpv1.tis.cwru.edu) X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Newsgroups: comp.lang.python Message-ID: Lines: 20 NNTP-Posting-Host: 2001:888:2000:d::a6 X-Trace: 1378947302 news.xs4all.nl 15953 [2001:888:2000:d::a6]:56093 X-Complaints-To: abuse@xs4all.nl Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.python:54020 On Wed, Sep 11, 2013 at 5:37 PM, Mark Janssen wrote: >> Unicode is not 16-bit any more than ASCII is 8-bit. And you used the >> word "encod[e]", which is the standard way to turn Unicode into bytes >> anyway. No, a Unicode string is a series of codepoints - it's most >> similar to a list of ints than to a stream of bytes. > > Okay, now you're in blah, blah land. > > --mark > -- There's no such thing as 16-bit Unicode. Unicode is a sequence of characters, not a sequence of bytes. It's an abstract thing. To work with it on a computer, you need to use a byte encoding because computers don't deal with with abstract things. UTF-16 is one encoding method that can map any character defined in Unicode to a sequence of bytes. UTF-16 isn't Unicode, it's just a function that maps a byte string to a character string. Python's unicode class is a character string- as far as the user is concerned, it's made up of those abstract "character" things and not bytes at all.