Path: csiph.com!v102.xanadu-bbs.net!xanadu-bbs.net!goblin2!goblin.stu.neva.ru!newsfeed.xs4all.nl!newsfeed4.news.xs4all.nl!xs4all!post.news.xs4all.nl!not-for-mail Return-Path: X-Original-To: python-list@python.org Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org X-Spam-Status: OK 0.040 X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 0.92; '*S*': 0.00; 'subject:: [': 0.03; 'patterns': 0.04; 'received:80.91': 0.09; 'received:80.91.229': 0.09; 'received:gmane.org': 0.09; 'received:list': 0.09; 'statistical': 0.09; 'underlying': 0.09; '*should*': 0.16; 'kern': 0.16; 'received:80.91.229.3': 0.16; 'received:plane.gmane.org': 0.16; 'subject:Line': 0.16; 'temperatures': 0.16; 'wrote:': 0.17; 'jan': 0.18; '>>>': 0.18; 'subject:] ': 0.19; 'changes': 0.20; 'amounts': 0.22; 'interpret': 0.22; 'absolute': 0.23; 'least': 0.25; 'header:In-Reply-To:1': 0.25; 'header:User-Agent:1': 0.26; 'looks': 0.26; 'scale': 0.27; 'header:X-Complaints-To:1': 0.28; 'chris': 0.28; 'cycles': 0.29; "d'aprano": 0.29; 'long.': 0.29; 'measure': 0.29; 'steven': 0.29; 'subject: [': 0.29; 'case,': 0.29; 'point': 0.31; 'to:addr:python-list': 0.33; 'robert': 0.35; 'subject:]': 0.35; 'pm,': 0.35; 'received:org': 0.36; 'but': 0.36; 'compare': 0.36; 'why': 0.37; 'quite': 0.37; 'subject:: ': 0.38; 'degree': 0.38; 'mean': 0.38; 'to:addr:python.org': 0.39; 'header:Received:5': 0.40; 'think': 0.40; 'bottom': 0.60; 'distance': 0.62; 'world': 0.63; 'show': 0.63; 'our': 0.65; 'debate': 0.65; 'talking': 0.66; 'believe': 0.69; 'sounds': 0.71; 'increase': 0.72; '2013': 0.84; 'climate': 0.84; 'degrees,': 0.84; 'eco': 0.84; 'nominal': 0.84; 'subject:removal': 0.84; 'surface': 0.84; 'temperature': 0.84; 'terrible': 0.84; 'weather': 0.84; 'received:86': 0.93 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ To: python-list@python.org From: Robert Kern Subject: Re: [Offtopic] Line fitting [was Re: Numpy outlier removal] Date: Tue, 08 Jan 2013 15:55:30 +0000 References: <50ea28e7$0$30003$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <50ea58f0$0$21851$c3e8da3$76491128@news.astraweb.com> <50eb0cd2$0$30003$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <50eb7f2a$0$30003$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: cpc2-cmbg17-2-0-cust347.5-4.cable.virginmedia.com User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.8; rv:17.0) Gecko/17.0 Thunderbird/17.0 In-Reply-To: X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Newsgroups: comp.lang.python Message-ID: Lines: 32 NNTP-Posting-Host: 2001:888:2000:d::a6 X-Trace: 1357660546 news.xs4all.nl 6854 [2001:888:2000:d::a6]:42928 X-Complaints-To: abuse@xs4all.nl Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.python:36437 On 08/01/2013 06:35, Chris Angelico wrote: > On Tue, Jan 8, 2013 at 1:06 PM, Steven D'Aprano > wrote: >>> given that weather patterns have been known to follow cycles at least >>> that long. >> >> That is not a given. "Weather patterns" don't last for thirty years. >> Perhaps you are talking about climate patterns? > > Yes, that's what I meant. In any case, debate about global warming is > quite tangential to the point about statistical validity; it looks > quite significant to show a line going from the bottom of the graph to > the top, but sounds a lot less noteworthy when you see it as a > half-degree increase on about (I think?) 30 degrees, and even less > when you measure temperatures in absolute scale (Kelvin) and it's half > a degree in three hundred. Why on Earth do you think that the distance from nominal surface temperatures to freezing much less absolute 0 is the right scale to compare global warming changes against? You need to compare against the size of global mean temperature changes that would cause large amounts of human suffering, and that scale is on the order of a *few* degrees, not hundreds. A change of half a degree over a few decades with no signs of slowing down *should* be alarming. -- Robert Kern "I have come to believe that the whole world is an enigma, a harmless enigma that is made terrible by our own mad attempt to interpret it as though it had an underlying truth." -- Umberto Eco