Path: csiph.com!usenet.pasdenom.info!news.redatomik.org!newsfeed.xs4all.nl!newsfeed2.news.xs4all.nl!xs4all!newsgate.cistron.nl!newsgate.news.xs4all.nl!post.news.xs4all.nl!not-for-mail Return-Path: X-Original-To: python-list@python.org Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org X-Spam-Status: OK 0.019 X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 0.96; '*S*': 0.00; 'subject:Python': 0.05; '(of': 0.07; 'rewrite': 0.07; 'immutable': 0.09; 'cc:addr:python- list': 0.10; 'itself.': 0.11; 'burns': 0.16; 'devil': 0.16; 'from:addr:rosuav': 0.16; 'from:name:chris angelico': 0.16; 'immutability': 0.16; 'number?': 0.16; 'similarly,': 0.16; 'subject:?)': 0.16; 'substitute': 0.16; 'wrote:': 0.16; "wouldn't": 0.16; 'instance,': 0.18; '(in': 0.18; '(or': 0.21; 'cc:2**0': 0.21; 'cc:addr:python.org': 0.21; 'am,': 0.23; '2015': 0.23; 'header:In-Reply-To:1': 0.24; 'written': 0.24; 'mon,': 0.24; 'message-id:@mail.gmail.com': 0.28; "doesn't": 0.28; 'dictionary': 0.29; 'piece': 0.29; 'prevention': 0.29; 'no,': 0.29; 'objects': 0.29; 'sense': 0.29; 'certainly': 0.31; 'point': 0.33; 'mass': 0.33; 'ram': 0.33; 'received:google.com': 0.34; 'could': 0.35; 'but': 0.36; 'being': 0.36; 'two': 0.37; 'subject:: ': 0.37; 'difference': 0.38; 'subject: (': 0.40; 'your': 0.60; 'she': 0.61; 'more.': 0.62; 'due': 0.65; 'between': 0.65; 'therefore': 0.65; 'physics': 0.66; 'phone': 0.67; 'believe': 0.67; "'3'": 0.84; '666': 0.84; 'chrisa': 0.84; 'destruction,': 0.84; 'entity.': 0.84; 'girl': 0.84; 'powder.': 0.84; 'to:none': 0.90 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:cc :content-type; bh=J965jfPo9w1ExbnbKLplsVKphoSMJjiM2uav4Q1eYb4=; b=U7CcZ7wpoo7N3/AVM85VCbpQHr1xugDxF9CS3XhroDzW5zPVHxGNFx/Hws3mE2CILj dcTg6KTQbAkZBxP0h4M5eY2nHEkgrNY4FHsCe9bMniEgQHgLr5ztp1sNgQAnHg7+nHYU 7Zaiuh8iJyDVIziBoFTzQ0lT/ohFBU9xTnt3ymlJzeZs9H1mbUykgV30dbJyjp8bM4vn s23MB6kkSHp+iFZcynopz8GyIPWWcweny46pdPqnUTWTnwVCtWSAR3C3kJrGcB/ynsNN O6osSOZCrwqAgHtnU6LUYs/ecrk1U0uicEfPJSdkQnHrdx+TjItmAnaNul9hErxwqPUd 5MNg== MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.50.176.228 with SMTP id cl4mr8949449igc.2.1433694862114; Sun, 07 Jun 2015 09:34:22 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <4fdc38b3-6b51-4f98-9ba3-42b265582fc0@googlegroups.com> References: <3bbe49da-e989-4a8c-a8a9-75d3a786f508@googlegroups.com> <557056f9$0$13009$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <5570ce43$0$12991$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <55710b69$0$12980$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <6c78b294-efd6-4096-a572-1841aa71a5eb@googlegroups.com> <557182af$0$13014$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <33a2f501-5587-4fd9-91fa-7094d4f6c512@googlegroups.com> <81cb1232-ecf8-4cf0-b29c-ecf2ca47ade0@googlegroups.com> <5fa1f672-50de-4481-9c5b-2c68c4e30f12@googlegroups.com> <4fdc38b3-6b51-4f98-9ba3-42b265582fc0@googlegroups.com> Date: Mon, 8 Jun 2015 02:34:22 +1000 Subject: Re: Lawful != Mutable (was Can Python function return multiple data?) From: Chris Angelico Cc: "python-list@python.org" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20+ Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Newsgroups: comp.lang.python Message-ID: Lines: 23 NNTP-Posting-Host: 2001:888:2000:d::a6 X-Trace: 1433694866 news.xs4all.nl 2926 [2001:888:2000:d::a6]:48632 X-Complaints-To: abuse@xs4all.nl Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.python:92269 On Mon, Jun 8, 2015 at 2:20 AM, Rustom Mody wrote: > Ok now rewrite that para above with > s/tuple/numbers like 3 or 666/ > So I put '3' on the ram and grind it to finest powder. > Have all trinities (of religious or secular variety) disappeared? > 666 gone has the devil been banished from God's (or Steven's) universe? If you write down your phone number and give it to a girl you like, and she burns that piece of paper, do you no longer have a phone number? No, but she certainly doesn't have your phone number any more. There's a difference between destroying a representation and destroying the original entity. But Steven's point wasn't about how easy/hard it is to destroy something; it was about a tuple's immutability NOT being a prevention of its destruction, and therefore it's not that sense of the word in which they're immutable. Similarly, you could destroy a document on which God's laws are written (in the original dictionary sense; if you don't want to believe in immutable laws of a Deity, you can substitute in a law of physics - for instance, the law that two objects with mass exert a force of attraction on each other due to gravity), and it wouldn't destroy the law itself. ChrisA