Path: csiph.com!usenet.pasdenom.info!weretis.net!feeder1.news.weretis.net!feeder.erje.net!eu.feeder.erje.net!xlned.com!feeder7.xlned.com!news2.euro.net!newsgate.cistron.nl!newsgate.news.xs4all.nl!post.news.xs4all.nl!not-for-mail Return-Path: X-Original-To: python-list@python.org Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org X-Spam-Status: OK 0.000 X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 1.00; '*S*': 0.00; 'string.': 0.04; 'subject:Python': 0.05; 'deprecated': 0.07; 'extracted': 0.07; 'false,': 0.07; 'ok.': 0.07; 'string;': 0.07; 'suppose': 0.07; 'trailing': 0.07; 'handling,': 0.09; 'php,': 0.09; 'assume': 0.11; '14:26,': 0.16; 'competent': 0.16; 'from:addr:mrabarnett.plus.com': 0.16; 'from:addr:python': 0.16; 'from:name:mrab': 0.16; 'longer.': 0.16; 'losing': 0.16; 'message- id:@mrabarnett.plus.com': 0.16; 'received:84.93': 0.16; 'received:84.93.230': 0.16; 'roy': 0.16; 'search:': 0.16; 'slash.': 0.16; 'later': 0.16; 'wed,': 0.16; 'string': 0.17; 'wrote:': 0.17; 'tend': 0.17; 'input': 0.18; '(or': 0.18; 'feb': 0.19; 'parameters': 0.20; 'supposed': 0.21; 'back.': 0.22; 'example': 0.23; 'work.': 0.23; 'somebody': 0.23; 'header:In- Reply-To:1': 0.25; 'header:User-Agent:1': 0.26; 'am,': 0.27; "doesn't": 0.28; 'actual': 0.28; 'chris': 0.28; 'search.': 0.29; 'things,': 0.29; 'character': 0.29; 'this.': 0.29; 'maybe': 0.29; 'worked': 0.30; 'web.': 0.30; 'problem.': 0.32; 'received:84': 0.32; 'goes': 0.33; 'int': 0.33; 'problem': 0.33; 'to:addr:python- list': 0.33; "can't": 0.34; 'false': 0.35; 'doing': 0.35; 'too.': 0.35; 'subject:?': 0.35; 'add': 0.36; 'really': 0.36; 'but': 0.36; "i'll": 0.36; 'does': 0.37; 'subject:: ': 0.38; 'some': 0.38; 'url:en': 0.38; 'page': 0.38; 'description': 0.39; 'to:addr:python.org': 0.39; 'received:192': 0.39; 'google': 0.39; 'received:192.168': 0.40; 'skip:u 10': 0.60; 'kind': 0.61; 'back': 0.62; "today's": 0.66; 'today': 0.67; 'header:Reply-To:1': 0.68; 'forums': 0.71; 'smith': 0.71; 'reply-to:no real name:2**0': 0.72; '"what': 0.84; '2013': 0.84; 'reply-to:addr:python.org': 0.84; 'say:': 0.84; 'url:function': 0.84; 'url:php': 0.86; 'subject:you': 0.88 X-CM-Score: 0.00 X-CNFS-Analysis: v=2.0 cv=HO4d4PRv c=1 sm=1 a=0nF1XD0wxitMEM03M9B4ZQ==:17 a=_vX2mLoUpDQA:10 a=fjKzYkSIBGoA:10 a=ihvODaAuJD4A:10 a=OUOv7kDek9cA:10 a=8nJEP1OIZ-IA:10 a=EBOSESyhAAAA:8 a=8AHkEIZyAAAA:8 a=pBiahiigKv4A:10 a=VUfPOBp7AAAA:8 a=67BIL_jfAAAA:8 a=8i5XyUAsWCye5vkz9aMA:9 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=OZVAQE2HkbQA:10 a=5hK03km2n30A:10 a=0nF1XD0wxitMEM03M9B4ZQ==:117 X-AUTH: mrabarnett:2500 Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2013 17:48:27 +0000 From: MRAB User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 5.1; rv:17.0) Gecko/20130215 Thunderbird/17.0.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: python-list@python.org Subject: Re: Do you feel bad because of the Python docs? References: <512cb0a0$0$30001$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list Reply-To: python-list@python.org List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Newsgroups: comp.lang.python Message-ID: Lines: 50 NNTP-Posting-Host: 2001:888:2000:d::a6 X-Trace: 1361900903 news.xs4all.nl 6852 [2001:888:2000:d::a6]:59074 X-Complaints-To: abuse@xs4all.nl Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.python:39979 On 2013-02-26 14:26, Chris Angelico wrote: > On Wed, Feb 27, 2013 at 12:56 AM, Roy Smith wrote: >> When people ask PHP questions, the questions tend to be phrased as "what >> do I type to get X", and the answers come back that way too. The forums >> are full of, "I had the same problem. Somebody told me to do this. I >> don't really understand it, but it worked for me and maybe it'll work >> for you too". > > A problem that's majorly exacerbated by the myriad ways of doing some > things, with some of those ways deprecated and others theoretically > plausible but hopelessly impractical. > > Here's an actual example that came up today at work. Suppose you have > a user-provided string that's supposed to contain a URL, and you need > to ensure that it doesn't have a trailing slash, so you can later add > "/foo" or "/bar". (Or alternatively, ensure that it DOES have a > trailing slash. Either works.) Start the timer, go find out how to do > it. Assume you are broadly familiar with PHP, and know how to do the > basics of string handling, and are competent at searching the web. > Ready? Go! > > I'll wait for you to come back. > > ... Okay, some of you are back now. Just giving the stragglers time to > finish losing their marbles... > > Alright. Here's what I found in a recreation of today's search. > Google search: php last character of string > > http://php.net/manual/en/function.substr.php > -- okay, so I can use substr, but not string indexing, to find out > what the last character is > -- "Returns the extracted part of string; or FALSE on failure, or an > empty string." What kind of failures result in FALSE, and what kind in > an empty string? > [snip] The page http://php.net/manual/en/function.substr.php says: Description string substr ( string $string , int $start [, int $length ] ) OK. It then goes on to say: Parameters string The input string. Must be one character or longer. What? The input string can't be an empty string?