Path: csiph.com!usenet.pasdenom.info!gegeweb.org!de-l.enfer-du-nord.net!feeder1.enfer-du-nord.net!feeds.phibee-telecom.net!newsfeed.xs4all.nl!newsfeed5.news.xs4all.nl!xs4all!newsgate.cistron.nl!newsgate.news.xs4all.nl!post.news.xs4all.nl!not-for-mail Return-Path: X-Original-To: python-list@python.org Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org X-Spam-Status: OK 0.000 X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 1.00; '*S*': 0.00; 'cache': 0.05; 'indicated': 0.07; 'item.': 0.07; 'behavior,': 0.09; 'bytes,': 0.09; 'immutable': 0.09; 'internally': 0.09; 'minus': 0.09; 'mutable': 0.09; 'pointers': 0.09; 'received:80.91': 0.09; 'received:80.91.229': 0.09; 'received:gmane.org': 0.09; 'received:list': 0.09; 'str,': 0.09; 'terry': 0.09; 'assume': 0.11; 'passing': 0.15; 'arrays,': 0.16; 'bytearrays,': 0.16; 'len': 0.16; 'received:80.91.229.3': 0.16; 'received:plane.gmane.org': 0.16; 'reedy': 0.16; 'subtraction': 0.16; 'wrote:': 0.17; 'jan': 0.18; 'operations.': 0.22; "i'd": 0.22; 'least': 0.25; 'header:In-Reply-To:1': 0.25; 'header:User- Agent:1': 0.26; 'done.': 0.27; 'possibility': 0.27; '(such': 0.27; 'header:X-Complaints-To:1': 0.28; 'overhead': 0.29; 'slot': 0.29; 'function': 0.30; 'could': 0.32; 'to:addr:python-list': 0.33; 'built-in': 0.35; 'so,': 0.35; 'doing': 0.35; 'pm,': 0.35; 'there': 0.35; 'received:org': 0.36; 'should': 0.36; 'two': 0.37; 'subject:: ': 0.38; 'to:addr:python.org': 0.39; 'called': 0.39; 'header:Received:5': 0.40; 'address': 0.60; 'first': 0.61; 'side': 0.61; 'safe': 0.63; 'subject:. ': 0.66; 'below.': 0.68; 'ranges': 0.71; 'calculations': 0.84; 'received:fios.verizon.net': 0.84; 'sets,': 0.84 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ To: python-list@python.org From: Terry Reedy Subject: Re: len() on mutables vs. immutables Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2012 14:29:28 -0400 References: <50803B2C.6010900@gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: pool-173-75-251-66.phlapa.fios.verizon.net User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:15.0) Gecko/20120824 Thunderbird/15.0 In-Reply-To: <50803B2C.6010900@gmail.com> X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Newsgroups: comp.lang.python Message-ID: Lines: 24 NNTP-Posting-Host: 2001:888:2000:d::a6 X-Trace: 1350584990 news.xs4all.nl 6907 [2001:888:2000:d::a6]:42076 X-Complaints-To: abuse@xs4all.nl Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.python:31671 On 10/18/2012 1:23 PM, Demian Brecht wrote: > When len() is called passing an immutable built-in type (such as a > string), I'd assume that the overhead in doing so is simply a function > call and there are no on-call calculations done. Is that correct? See below. > I'd also assume that mutable built-in types (such as a bytearray) would > cache their size internally as a side effect of mutation operations. Is Or the length could be the difference of two pointers -- address of the first empty slot minus address of first item. > that correct? If so, is it safe to assume that at least all built-in > types observe this behavior, str, bytes, bytearrays, arrays, sets, frozensets, dicts, dictviews, and ranges should all return len in O(1) time. That includes the possibility of a subtraction as indicated above. -- Terry Jan Reedy