Path: csiph.com!usenet.pasdenom.info!gegeweb.org!de-l.enfer-du-nord.net!feeder2.enfer-du-nord.net!newsfeed.eweka.nl!eweka.nl!feeder3.eweka.nl!newsfeed.xs4all.nl!newsfeed2.news.xs4all.nl!xs4all!newsgate.cistron.nl!newsgate.news.xs4all.nl!post.news.xs4all.nl!not-for-mail Return-Path: X-Original-To: python-list@python.org Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org X-Spam-Status: OK 0.001 X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 1.00; '*S*': 0.00; 'subject:Python': 0.05; 'ugly': 0.07; 'python': 0.09; 'brackets': 0.09; 'compilers.': 0.09; 'dumps': 0.09; 'lawrence': 0.09; 'received:80.91': 0.09; 'received:80.91.229': 0.09; 'received:gmane.org': 0.09; 'received:list': 0.09; 'wastes': 0.09; '(c#,': 0.16; 'contributors': 0.16; 'ignores': 0.16; 'long-time': 0.16; 'mark,': 0.16; 'received:80.91.229.3': 0.16; 'received:plane.gmane.org': 0.16; "someone's": 0.16; 'wrote:': 0.17; 'widely': 0.17; '>>>': 0.18; 'code,': 0.18; 'parse': 0.22; 'required.': 0.22; 'programming': 0.23; 'for?': 0.23; 'statement': 0.23; 'header:In- Reply-To:1': 0.25; 'header:User-Agent:1': 0.26; 'language.': 0.27; 'newer': 0.27; 'header:X-Complaints-To:1': 0.28; 'surprised': 0.29; 'words': 0.29; '"the': 0.29; "i'm": 0.29; 'code': 0.31; 'anybody': 0.32; 'from:addr:yahoo.co.uk': 0.32; 'could': 0.32; 'impression': 0.33; 'anyone': 0.33; 'to:addr:python-list': 0.33; 'languages': 0.33; 'community': 0.35; 'something': 0.35; 'received:org': 0.36; 'really': 0.36; 'except': 0.36; 'but': 0.36; 'programmers': 0.36; 'visual': 0.36; 'bad': 0.37; 'being': 0.37; 'rather': 0.37; 'subject:: ': 0.38; 'mark': 0.38; 'nothing': 0.38; 'to:addr:python.org': 0.39; 'short': 0.39; 'where': 0.40; 'header:Received:5': 0.40; 'your': 0.60; 'most': 0.61; 'first': 0.61; 'back': 0.62; 'email addr:gmail.com': 0.63; 'more': 0.63; 'here': 0.65; 'hang': 0.65; 'day': 0.73; 'widespread': 0.91 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ To: python-list@python.org From: Mark Lawrence Subject: Re: Python Newbie Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2013 20:41:16 +0000 References: <5127848B.1060004@gmail.com> <928d2cf7-728b-4f35-b8c9-4c9b958507e5@googlegroups.com> <61471a01-ee6e-4bc6-bd08-8696a31ec1eb@googlegroups.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: host-92-18-29-221.as13285.net User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.0; rv:17.0) Gecko/20130215 Thunderbird/17.0.3 In-Reply-To: <61471a01-ee6e-4bc6-bd08-8696a31ec1eb@googlegroups.com> X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 130224-0, 24/02/2013), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Newsgroups: comp.lang.python Message-ID: Lines: 31 NNTP-Posting-Host: 2001:888:2000:d::a6 X-Trace: 1361738327 news.xs4all.nl 6916 [2001:888:2000:d::a6]:48202 X-Complaints-To: abuse@xs4all.nl Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.python:39786 On 24/02/2013 19:40, piterrr.dolinski@gmail.com wrote: >>> if (some statement): # short form >>> >>> rather than >>> >>> if (some statement == true): # long form >> >> >> What all those ugly brackets are for? >> > > Mark, > > Back in the day when C was king, or take many newer long established languages (C#, Java), the use of () has been widespread and mandated by the compilers. I have never heard anyone moan about the requirement to use parentheses. Now come Python in which parens are optional, and all of a sudden they are considered bad and apparently widely abandoned. Do you really not see that code with parens is much more pleasing visually? I could understand someone's reluctance to use parens if they are very new to programming and Pythons is their first language. But my impression here is that most group contributors are long-time programmers and have long used () where they are required. Again, I'm really surprised the community as a whole ignores the programming "heritage" and dumps the parens in a hea > rtbeat. > > Peter > Your words "the use of () has been widespread and mandated by the compilers" and "have long used () where they are required". As they are neither mandated nor required in Python it just wastes the time of anybody reading code as they have to parse something that offers nothing except visual noise. As for being "visually pleasing" that's simply laughable. I want to be able to read code, not hang it in an art gallery. -- Cheers. Mark Lawrence