X-FeedAbuse: http://nntpfeed.proxad.net/abuse.pl feeded by 88.191.16.109 Path: csiph.com!x330-a1.tempe.blueboxinc.net!usenet.pasdenom.info!news.dougwise.org!nntpfeed.proxad.net!nospam.fr.eu.org!usenet-fr.net!de-l.enfer-du-nord.net!feeder2.enfer-du-nord.net!newsfeed.eweka.nl!eweka.nl!feeder3.eweka.nl!newsfeed.xs4all.nl!newsfeed5.news.xs4all.nl!xs4all!post.news.xs4all.nl!not-for-mail Return-Path: X-Original-To: python-list@python.org Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org X-Spam-Status: OK 0.005 X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 0.99; '*S*': 0.00; 'python,': 0.01; 'backwards': 0.07; 'python': 0.08; 'scripts': 0.09; 'clearly,': 0.09; 'am,': 0.12; "';'": 0.16; '(well,': 0.16; 'code).': 0.16; 'lan': 0.16; 'magnitude.': 0.16; 'occasionally': 0.16; 'parentheses': 0.16; 'truely': 0.16; 'cc:addr:python-list': 0.16; 'wrote:': 0.16; "wouldn't": 0.17; 'cheers,': 0.18; 'cc:2**0': 0.22; 'header:In-Reply-To:1': 0.22; '(without': 0.23; 'indentation': 0.23; 'optional': 0.23; 'pair': 0.23; 'received:209.85.213.46': 0.23; 'received:mail- yw0-f46.google.com': 0.23; 'aug': 0.24; 'code': 0.25; 'code,': 0.28; '(see': 0.28; 'thu,': 0.28; 'message-id:@mail.gmail.com': 0.29; 'cc:addr:python.org': 0.30; 'lines': 0.30; 'splitting': 0.30; 'chris': 0.32; 'break': 0.32; 'done': 0.34; 'smart': 0.34; 'rather': 0.35; 'trouble': 0.35; 'assuming': 0.37; 'machine': 0.37; 'but': 0.37; 'think': 0.38; 'from:': 0.38; 'steven': 0.38; 'received:google.com': 0.38; 'received:209.85': 0.38; 'should': 0.38; 'subject:: ': 0.39; 'case': 0.39; 'called': 0.40; "it's": 0.40; 'free': 0.63; '11,': 0.68; 'dealing': 0.69; 'subject:line': 0.73; 'unnecessary': 0.73; 'programs,': 0.80; 'to:addr:yahoo.com': 0.83; '12:24': 0.84; '12:52': 0.84; 'sender:addr:chris': 0.84 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=rebertia.com; s=google; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date :x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=BNT9JKo1xFM3I7HEvboYrp2XGnMjUp0dc/HBNKUvbJc=; b=fho4T8scU6R5qVM0rMVHMowsx5NNimxLQXGdHL2/xAfvDAPh+52hGOXT3XTF8d43jG mMIvBMLf2Q/8z65mr0zkm8lI48sf+0L28+tBZrqbCnXRGSEaQ6FbsckAoMrPWY51MZDB BRFoBEWlJgVATjRkzXZLoKDma65xkg04FONQw= MIME-Version: 1.0 Sender: chris@rebertia.com In-Reply-To: <1313047464.90324.YahooMailNeo@web121515.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> References: <1312951356.77394.YahooMailNeo@web121518.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> <4e424208$0$29965$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <1312981104.89312.YahooMailNeo@web121520.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> <1312982377.95657.YahooMailNeo@web121508.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> <4e43582e$0$29969$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <1313047464.90324.YahooMailNeo@web121515.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2011 00:50:26 -0700 X-Google-Sender-Auth: uGpp3XqD4Zttlc7qOWOerK0TG4Y Subject: Re: allow line break at operators From: Chris Rebert To: Yingjie Lan Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Cc: "python-list@python.org" X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Newsgroups: comp.lang.python Message-ID: Lines: 36 NNTP-Posting-Host: 2001:888:2000:d::a6 X-Trace: 1313049029 news.xs4all.nl 23856 [2001:888:2000:d::a6]:42488 X-Complaints-To: abuse@xs4all.nl Xref: x330-a1.tempe.blueboxinc.net comp.lang.python:11193 On Thu, Aug 11, 2011 at 12:24 AM, Yingjie Lan wrote: > From: Steven D'Aprano > On Thu, 11 Aug 2011 12:52 pm Yingjie Lan wrote: > >> :And if we require {} then truly free indentation should be OK too! But >> >> :it wouldn't be Python any more. >> >> Of course, but not the case with ';'. Currently ';' is optional in Python, >> But '{' is used for dicts. Clearly, ';' and '{' are different in >> magnitude. >> >> So the decision is: shall we change ';' from optional to mandatory >> to allow free line splitting? > > :Why on earth would you want to break backwards compatibility of millions of > :Python scripts and programs, and require extra, unnecessary line-noise on > :every single line of Python code, just so that you can occasionally avoid a > :writing a pair of parentheses? > > I think allowing free line splitting (without parentheses -- that's > artifitial and > requires the coder to serve the machine rather than the other way around) > with proper indentation will produce truely ergonomic code layout (well, > assuming you also like properly indented code). > > And this can be done almost hassle-free for the coder. > The trouble of adding a ';' to most of the lines can also be > avoided by a smart editor (see my other reply). The trouble of dealing with long lines can be avoided by a smart editor. It's called line wrap. Cheers, Chris