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Newsgroups: comp.lang.python
Date: Sat, 13 Oct 2012 11:18:44 -0700 (PDT)
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Subject: Re: Feedback on my python framework I'm building.
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On Saturday, October 13, 2012 12:48:23 PM UTC-4, Chris Angelico wrote:
> No, I don't, because I haven't tried to use it. But allow me to give
> two examples, one on each side of the argument.
>=20
> The 'tee' utility is primarily for writing a pipe to disk AND to
> further pipelining, for instance:

Could you please spent 10 minutes to read through the tutorial? The 'tee' u=
nix utility and ctypes describes the way giotto goes about it business very=
 well. Traditional web frameworks (such as django and rails) are too much o=
f a 'magic the gathering' for my taste, which is why I'm writing giotto.

I'm really not looking for general "why I hate frameworks" criticism. I'm l=
ooking for specific criticism of the framework that I am writing.

> This is, in my opinion, not a good thing. If you have to change your
> API radically to support something you just thought of, then something
> you still haven't thought of may require another radical API change.

Not all api's get it right on the first shot. I'm more interested in gettin=
g it right, rather than patching together a bunch of random 'fixes' ala PHP=
.

> The only way to support *absolutely everything* is to do nothing - to
> be a framework so thin you're invisible. (That's not to say you're

You just described what Giotto is trying to do, since Giotto doesn't touch =
the model at all.

>  This is why I say it's likely not a good thing that your framework
> *forces* the separation of model/view/controller. You make it
> impossible to temporarily ignore the framework.

Exactly. When you 'break out of the framework' you pile on technical debt. =
I want to force developers to not do that.