Path: csiph.com!usenet.pasdenom.info!weretis.net!feeder4.news.weretis.net!ecngs!feeder2.ecngs.de!newsfeed.freenet.ag!news2.euro.net!newsgate.cistron.nl!newsgate.news.xs4all.nl!post.news.xs4all.nl!not-for-mail
Newsgroups: comp.lang.python
Date: Sat, 13 Oct 2012 08:57:47 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To: <mailman.2116.1350137553.27098.python-list@python.org>
Complaints-To: groups-abuse@google.com
Injection-Info: glegroupsg2000goo.googlegroups.com; posting-host=173.88.33.244; posting-account=s5n-HgoAAAADkPp3Xa9skJeRDkBou06u
References: <634c9dca-e64d-40c6-b9d5-cf04a86a220a@googlegroups.com> <mailman.2116.1350137553.27098.python-list@python.org>
User-Agent: G2/1.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: Re: Feedback on my python framework I'm building.
From: nbvfour@gmail.com
To: comp.lang.python@googlegroups.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Cc: python-list@python.org
Precedence: list
Message-ID: <mailman.2120.1350143875.27098.python-list@python.org>
Lines: 50
NNTP-Posting-Host: 2001:888:2000:d::a6
Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.python:31202

On Saturday, October 13, 2012 10:13:22 AM UTC-4, Chris Angelico wrote:
> On Sat, Oct 13, 2012 at 3:49 PM,  <nbvfour@gmail.com> wrote:
>=20
> > Basically its a framework that forces the developer(s) to strictly sepa=
rate the model from the view and controller. You can 'hook up' multiple con=
trollers to a project. The model layer can be completely mocked out so fron=
t end designers don't have to bother setting up Postgres/rabbitmq/whatever.
>=20
>=20
>=20
> I don't like frameworks that force too much. Actually, I guess that
>=20
> means I don't like frameworks at all, I like toolsets. Let the
>=20
> programmer decide what he wants to do.
>=20
>=20
>=20
> That said, though, there are times when a good framework can do 90% of
>=20
> your work for you. The trouble comes when you want to do something the
>=20
> author didn't think of - you might well end up either fighting against
>=20
> the system, or modifying the framework to suit your task (and that
>=20
> works only if you created it yourself). Thin frameworks are usually
>=20
> immune to this, but on the flip side, they're less likely to be doing
>=20
> most of your work for you.
>=20
>=20
>=20
> It's really easy to demo something and show how awesome it is. How
>=20
> easily can it be turned to a task it was never built for?
>=20
>=20
>=20
> ChrisA

Do you have an example of a task that giotto can't handle that other framew=
orks can? One of my goals is to have this framework "turing complete" in th=
e sense that everything that other frameworks can do, giotto should be able=
 to do. I think my controller -> input_middleware -> model -> cache -> view=
 -> output_middleware pattern pretty much allows for anything. Throughout t=
he development process, I've radically changed the API many times when it w=
as discovered that a certain task would be very hard (for instance authenti=
cation)