Path: csiph.com!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!not-for-mail
From: Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com>
Newsgroups: comp.lang.python
Subject: Re: Everything good about Python except GUI IDE?
Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2016 03:17:58 +1100
Lines: 23
Message-ID: <mailman.20.1456762687.20602.python-list@python.org>
References: <64a6599c-fae1-469d-bcee-875165b3cc7d@googlegroups.com> <mailman.172.1456574862.20994.python-list@python.org> <56d294f8$0$1604$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <naupig$upg$1@dont-email.me> <234a398e-1b0f-467b-a8cb-d7ca748f8062@googlegroups.com> <naur90$58b$1@dont-email.me> <84922f24-3e00-4a23-b26d-5e6c0d8e7e04@googlegroups.com> <87y4a5c58i.fsf@elektro.pacujo.net> <e805ec03-82dd-40bc-9a44-344620d435a9@googlegroups.com> <87twksdg9c.fsf@elektro.pacujo.net> <ioi7dbtldo5fej0i41gugcv0pa9pj04j58@4ax.com> <87d1rgca58.fsf@elektro.pacujo.net> <c0c563c0-1caf-4d3b-93f8-c62db864b5a3@googlegroups.com> <mailman.2.1456734047.20602.python-list@python.org> <nb1ovl$ad7$1@reader1.panix.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de aRR3NO0cAf4niz0KDLGuUAtY/iAdeTUlU/lnfq+sYA1A==
Return-Path: <rosuav@gmail.com>
X-Original-To: python-list@python.org
Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org
X-Spam-Status: OK 0.022
X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 0.96; '*S*': 0.00; 'received:209.85.223': 0.03; 'subject:Python': 0.05; 'cc:addr:python-list': 0.09; 'html/css': 0.09; '2016': 0.16; 'from:addr:rosuav': 0.16; 'from:name:chris angelico': 0.16; 'interaction,': 0.16; 'losing': 0.16; 'non-trivial': 0.16; 'received:io': 0.16; 'received:psf.io': 0.16; 'subject:GUI': 0.16; 'wrote:': 0.16; 'else,': 0.18; 'gui': 0.18; 'load': 0.20; 'cc:2**0': 0.20; 'cc:addr:python.org': 0.20; 'am,': 0.23; 'decide': 0.23; '(or': 0.23; 'plain': 0.24; 'header :In-Reply-To:1': 0.24; 'script': 0.25; 'chris': 0.26; 'message- id:@mail.gmail.com': 0.27; 'actual': 0.28; 'cgi': 0.29; 'loads': 0.29; 'screen.': 0.29; 'probably': 0.31; 'tue,': 0.34; 'except': 0.34; 'requirements': 0.35; 'received:google.com': 0.35; 'but': 0.36; 'instead': 0.36; 'received:209.85': 0.36; 'basic': 0.36; 'subject:?': 0.36; 'subject:: ': 0.37; 'really': 0.37; 'done.': 0.37; 'experience,': 0.38; 'received:209': 0.38; 'why': 0.39; 'goes': 0.39; 'some': 0.40; 'ever': 0.60; 'your': 0.60; 'making': 0.62; 'mar': 0.65; 'marketing': 0.72; 'battle.': 0.84; 'chrisa': 0.84; 'layout.': 0.84; 'non-critical': 0.84; 'subject:good': 0.84; 'virtue': 0.84; 'to:none': 0.91; 'edwards': 0.91
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:cc; bh=/3DhnFBxSpWdVQQuFTKfmmylWSpQPNHnfjlJYcmklSI=; b=coD5JkqjFbnUjCcmbtpLzoIS9E6LkvlykPmhyXw8bXFpSz6yzu5gLn9/P0rB6ohcmO 8AXxm2TwJrDt1xXMNxX5ZwyeanGAmkQzmCNiBhRHn0rFY9uwz420PE0OkVXBQI5Gq7mK LBe+vdf6j7f5VQfpqdxmD4YlZzLLCkyaJmY2UIGlcmWrguh7cx+vsbITyMQg8eP32+dq ++6UVnTinN58sygYJ2DOOVjsxx7Ahv18iwE1kyWyREb8/h0zDXe1IoYzQc/MOiJk+Oda BVgZ2IAdoMXS6o6B3G6+RkGasUA1dt7J2XE2ymew8MiLxMbjvVOnBfYX7AmiWqq0zh96 ftwQ==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:cc; bh=/3DhnFBxSpWdVQQuFTKfmmylWSpQPNHnfjlJYcmklSI=; b=EUEl42YLXuFOPGgCQmO5EC/9AbWajZPTxFxambJ1djnqMOiIGYNSj4x2Z0qdaPX4ys ovCsU3yiRB0W41wBIfoOgMjIUybUgKdq6P9XIT4BS+DEXM53jevSv/SbXOckf5+fA0pR jStszLTmf+iyT3xlRTFVWVU/R8uu8cEIlbsdY4cSLF4nIlkDR+AtWLXGUDVDUw3vg4Sc eixgLwEL5wUmUxoi2RZ0mMaJqs1xwfrgKsx8v82nRrG7KpcFg0aj7IjXZ5n4qejWmzSA Dk2yHuAu71PrsZvLEs2j2bXGTTLOd+tX/4rrnMa4RQI7n9r28SOC5PYNNs78qTOJ4wHX AdjQ==
X-Gm-Message-State: AD7BkJLaVl6vpgNurATrJI5GYdgLGC7i1TNDo/7eZz/7mpyQWoJ33Dj20tbDPaLkuALmoJm3noqHk+H7m25cTA==
X-Received: by 10.107.63.137 with SMTP id m131mr8815878ioa.157.1456762678560; Mon, 29 Feb 2016 08:17:58 -0800 (PST)
In-Reply-To: <nb1ovl$ad7$1@reader1.panix.com>
X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21
Precedence: list
List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language <python-list.python.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-list>, <mailto:python-list-request@python.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-list/>
List-Post: <mailto:python-list@python.org>
List-Help: <mailto:python-list-request@python.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list>, <mailto:python-list-request@python.org?subject=subscribe>
Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.python:103728

On Tue, Mar 1, 2016 at 2:43 AM, Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> wrote:
> On 2016-02-29, Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Abjuring JS may be a virtue (or at least, making it a non-critical
>> part of your web site),
>
> Except the marketing people who decide on the requirements will never,
> ever settle for what you can do with plain HTML/CSS.
>
> In my experience, HTML/CSS makes a pretty awful GUI for a non-trivial
> application.  With some Javascript and sweat, you can almost make it
> to mediocre.

That's why I said "may be". A pure CGI web site is pretty annoying
unless it's really brilliantly done. However, I prefer to see JS
restricted to actual interaction, instead of making it critical to the
basic layout. A lot of web sites these days load nothing but a script
that goes and loads everything else, while you gaze at a splash
screen. IMO that's unideal.

However, even that is probably a losing battle. :(

ChrisA