Path: csiph.com!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!not-for-mail From: Michael Torrie Newsgroups: comp.lang.python Subject: Re: Everything good about Python except GUI IDE? Date: Sun, 5 Jun 2016 22:01:29 -0600 Lines: 34 Message-ID: References: <64a6599c-fae1-469d-bcee-875165b3cc7d@googlegroups.com> <56d294f8$0$1604$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <56d5c4b6$0$1591$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <87y4a2ax8g.fsf@elektro.pacujo.net> <56d64730$0$1589$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <87egbtbfmy.fsf@elektro.pacujo.net> <878u21uw7p.fsf@elektro.pacujo.net> <87twkoa4nt.fsf@elektro.pacujo.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de VrDj1PFFVuphbpA6IdDdSg/4Yk8xKYpwd8GTa/ArdoVQ== Return-Path: X-Original-To: python-list@python.org Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org X-Spam-Status: OK 0.004 X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 0.99; '*S*': 0.00; 'subject:Python': 0.05; 'emulate': 0.07; 'wrapper': 0.07; 'generators': 0.09; 'scripting': 0.09; 'stdout': 0.09; 'streams.': 0.09; 'python': 0.10; 'python.': 0.11; 'syntax': 0.13; '(but': 0.15; 'things.': 0.15; 'efficiently.': 0.16; 'from:addr:torriem': 0.16; 'from:name:michael torrie': 0.16; 'pipelines': 0.16; 'received:io': 0.16; 'received:psf.io': 0.16; 'subject:GUI': 0.16; 'url:dabeaz': 0.16; 'wrote:': 0.16; 'shell': 0.18; 'library': 0.20; 'fairly': 0.22; 'pipe': 0.22; 'programming': 0.22; 'wrote': 0.23; "python's": 0.23; 'tried': 0.24; 'header:In-Reply-To:1': 0.24; 'sort': 0.25; "i've": 0.25; 'header:User-Agent:1': 0.26; 'example': 0.26; 'command': 0.26; 'external': 0.27; 'error': 0.27; 'idea': 0.28; 'regular': 0.29; 'another.': 0.29; 'callable': 0.29; 'figured': 0.29; 'python).': 0.29; 'routine': 0.29; 'launch': 0.29; 'creating': 0.30; 'code': 0.30; 'another': 0.32; 'problem': 0.33; 'stream': 0.33; 'message-id:@gmail.com': 0.34; 'worked': 0.34; 'requirements': 0.35; 'could': 0.35; 'text': 0.35; 'functions.': 0.35; 'whilst': 0.35; 'but': 0.36; 'should': 0.36; 'there': 0.36; 'to:addr:python-list': 0.36; 'subject:?': 0.36; 'pm,': 0.36; 'subject:: ': 0.37; 'received:org': 0.37; 'thought': 0.37; 'seem': 0.37; 'doing': 0.38; 'end': 0.39; 'received:192': 0.39; 'well.': 0.40; 'to:addr:python.org': 0.40; 'still': 0.40; 'real': 0.62; 'programs': 0.62; 'charset:windows-1252': 0.62; 'url:pdf': 0.64; 'decided': 0.66; 'superior': 0.67; 'natural': 0.67; 'facilities': 0.72; 'hand': 0.82; '10%,': 0.84; 'analog': 0.84; 'mind:': 0.84; 'piping': 0.84; 'streams': 0.84; 'subject:good': 0.84 X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at torriefamily.org User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:45.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/45.0 In-Reply-To: <87twkoa4nt.fsf@elektro.pacujo.net> X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Mailman-Original-Message-ID: X-Mailman-Original-References: <64a6599c-fae1-469d-bcee-875165b3cc7d@googlegroups.com> <56d294f8$0$1604$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <56d5c4b6$0$1591$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <87y4a2ax8g.fsf@elektro.pacujo.net> <56d64730$0$1589$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <87egbtbfmy.fsf@elektro.pacujo.net> <878u21uw7p.fsf@elektro.pacujo.net> <87twkoa4nt.fsf@elektro.pacujo.net> Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.python:109537 On 03/02/2016 03:36 PM, Marko Rauhamaa wrote: > Requirements for what I have in mind: > > 1. It would have to be and feel like real Python. > > 2. External commands should be available as callable Python functions. > > 3. Functions/commands should return streams. (Generators, maybe?) > > 4. Pipelines should have an intuitive syntax (but still be valid > Python). > > Requirements 3 and 4 apply to regular Python code as well. I've thought about this before and even tried my hand at creating a nice library for doing this sort of thing with Python. Generators seem like a natural analog for the shell pipes. However there is one big problem with them and that is they can only deal with one stream at a time. Whereas in shell programming there are 2 streams that you can use and connect simultaneously. For example I can simultaneously pipe standard out from a program to another command whilst piping standard error to another. I never figured out a way to emulate this idea of piping multiple streams. In the end I decided that Python's superior text processing facilities eliminated 90% of the reason to use pipes. And for the other 10%, generators worked extremely well and efficiently. http://www.dabeaz.com/generators/Generators.pdf When I was doing a lot of shell scripting in Python I wrote my own wrapper routine to launch programs and obtain stdout and stderr, which I could process with generator filters and that worked fairly elegantly for many things. Kind of a half-way approach but it worked well.