Path: csiph.com!usenet.pasdenom.info!aioe.org!news.stack.nl!newsfeed.xs4all.nl!newsfeed3a.news.xs4all.nl!xs4all!post.news.xs4all.nl!not-for-mail Return-Path: X-Original-To: python-list@python.org Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org X-Spam-Status: OK 0.001 X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 1.00; '*S*': 0.00; 'subject:error': 0.03; '(of': 0.07; 'attribute': 0.07; 'error:': 0.07; 'classes.': 0.09; 'instance.': 0.09; 'obj': 0.09; 'objects,': 0.09; 'python:': 0.09; 'sub': 0.09; 'type,': 0.09; 'python': 0.11; '>the': 0.16; 'attribute.': 0.16; 'descriptor': 0.16; 'invocation': 0.16; 'marco': 0.16; 'object)': 0.16; 'type)': 0.16; 'all.': 0.16; 'wrote:': 0.18; 'bit': 0.19; '>>>': 0.22; 'header:User-Agent:1': 0.23; 'pass': 0.26; 'header:In-Reply-To:1': 0.27; 'statement': 0.30; "d'aprano": 0.31; 'steven': 0.31; 'phone:': 0.31; 'class': 0.32; 'says': 0.33; '"the': 0.34; 'problem': 0.35; 'objects': 0.35; 'one,': 0.35; 'but': 0.35; 'received:google.com': 0.35; 'there': 0.35; 'object,': 0.36; 'too': 0.37; 'to:addr:python- list': 0.38; 'fact': 0.38; 'to:addr:python.org': 0.39; 'read': 0.60; 'therefore,': 0.64; 'charset:windows-1252': 0.65; 'details': 0.65; 'between': 0.67; 'header:Reply-To:1': 0.67; 'reply-to:no real name:2**0': 0.71; 'this...': 0.84 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=from:message-id:date:reply-to:user-agent:mime-version:to:subject :references:in-reply-to:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=wJDsYVmlAxve7epBqyeVf1kTywOrCNBCOTE539F9F1Q=; b=So5q66WNcgM8uYFysylQVA8Jav4bjEIB+iSfsu6Aa7qS0euQ+mdWL3ylkG+hMHzNCi L4r/RkyfKJT2mN6Q4fqiSqGwC7h2LS6VrhqF7YhT6b7KB6qRo3crXXEvqRhpyYnSEES6 Xf13+jZo0FIc1GAij2+T4QuSE9Mn5ZHCwwDpKnpCb5dxyTjr6EelBoOU6sHcGAm4ETBZ 9gK5UkimFhfHREDaws7Ftdm6paVjcbZloBUg+YWcZpMh5g7FJyZQNea2PTtXcUQbYrgB SNI5GUcZL1fDiBBrG6iOvL+fDbhX3G7F/ZUbY91DRGxQwRCcU1OUE+zRfHn/4G1myS7d LtCw== X-Received: by 10.180.72.199 with SMTP id f7mr14095829wiv.58.1422108759951; Sat, 24 Jan 2015 06:12:39 -0800 (PST) From: Marco Buttu X-Google-Original-From: Marco Buttu Date: Sat, 24 Jan 2015 15:12:36 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/31.1.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: python-list@python.org Subject: Re: __bases__ misleading error message References: <1a194e0a0b738d205de54180fa7@nntp.aioe.org> <54c39366$0$13006$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> In-Reply-To: <54c39366$0$13006$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailman-Approved-At: Mon, 26 Jan 2015 09:15:18 +0100 X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list Reply-To: mbuttu@oa-cagliari.inaf.it List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Newsgroups: comp.lang.python Message-ID: Lines: 45 NNTP-Posting-Host: 2001:888:2000:d::a6 X-Trace: 1422260120 news.xs4all.nl 2847 [2001:888:2000:d::a6]:53601 X-Complaints-To: abuse@xs4all.nl Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.python:84595 On 24/01/2015 13:43, Steven D'Aprano wrote: > Mario Figueiredo wrote: >> > class Sub: >> > pass >> > >> > foo = Sub() >> > >> > Sub.__bases__ >> > foo.__bases__ >> > >> >The last statement originates the following error: >> > >> > AttributeError: 'Sub' object has no attribute '__bases__' > It's a bit ambiguous, but the way to read it is to think of object as a > synonym for instance. In my opinion it is not ambiguous, because as you say in Python an object is a synonym for instance. We can say in Python an object is an instance of the type object, that's all. And that's why everything is an object in Python: >>> isisntace(foo, object) # For every foo True So a class (a type) is an instance too (of its metaclass). Therefore, the message says that the Sub instance has no attribute '__bases__'. In fact the Sub object (instance) has no attribute '__bases__' because it is not an instance of type, and only types (classes) have this attribute. That means in Python sometimes, like the OP one, we have to underline the difference between types (classes) and non-types (non-classes) objects, instead of between objects and classes. The problem is in the Python documentation there is also a bit of confusion about this... In the descriptor howto: "The details of invocation depend on whether obj is an object or a class" :/ -- Marco Buttu INAF-Osservatorio Astronomico di Cagliari Via della Scienza n. 5, 09047 Selargius (CA) Phone: 070 711 80 217 Email: mbuttu@oa-cagliari.inaf.it