Path: csiph.com!usenet.pasdenom.info!weretis.net!feeder4.news.weretis.net!feeds.phibee-telecom.net!newsfeed.xs4all.nl!newsfeed1.news.xs4all.nl!xs4all!newsgate.cistron.nl!newsgate.news.xs4all.nl!post.news.xs4all.nl!not-for-mail
Return-Path: <rosuav@gmail.com>
X-Original-To: python-list@python.org
Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org
X-Spam-Status: UNSURE 0.242
X-Spam-Level: **
X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 0.54; '*S*': 0.03; 'wiki': 0.03; 'binary': 0.07; 'accelerator': 0.09; 'advice,': 0.16; 'from:addr:rosuav': 0.16; 'from:name:chris angelico': 0.16; 'subject:default': 0.16; 'sat,': 0.16; 'fix': 0.17; 'wrote:': 0.18; 'url:moin': 0.24; "i've": 0.25; 'posts': 0.26; 'header:In-Reply-To:1': 0.27; 'ride': 0.30; 'sets': 0.30; 'message-id:@mail.gmail.com': 0.30; "i'm": 0.30; 'posting': 0.31; 'url:wiki': 0.31; 'piece': 0.31; 'post.': 0.31; 'run': 0.32; 'url:python': 0.33; 'bus': 0.33; 'problem': 0.35; 'subject: (': 0.35; "can't": 0.35; 'advice': 0.35; 'agree': 0.35; 'problem.': 0.35; 'but': 0.35; 'received:google.com': 0.35; 'google': 0.35; "i'll": 0.36; 'url:org': 0.36; 'to:addr:python- list': 0.38; 'pm,': 0.38; 'that,': 0.38; 'extremely': 0.39; 'to:addr:python.org': 0.39; 'how': 0.40; 'read': 0.60; 'easy': 0.60; 'company': 0.60; 'flat': 0.60; 'matter': 0.61; 'times': 0.62; "you'll": 0.62; '26,': 0.68; 'results': 0.69; 'carefully': 0.74; 'drivers': 0.74; 'reading,': 0.84; 'usage.': 0.84; 'absolutely': 0.87; 'demand': 0.91; 'ratio': 0.91; 'rusi': 0.91; 'subject:Don': 0.91; 'ultimate': 0.93; '2013': 0.98
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; bh=J117WUK9yDfrIn1HyIGkEDdbltdd5f5zoyrVQDf/85A=; b=0Fa5Qsrgf5hFqgJM5W0plrET3wP4PKUY5Hm7qGdbzegKLoq1Q3uXDWli82ZOjz4qf9 gXU2k+WQI+HTAxxxhlTpu6vxs6h7dl9AMqyC47ib+7Iwm3WAlbnzEvLYV37gmjqSrX7x UEpzQU5fmilsn0fkluj9beuuQstUmNBo7vhl+uxsP1VmqORuXylh7Kq2A7SIq3kSj0B0 5VK45JcKwRWDW8jkcvt1agHndDHFcNPJl9IPlph2uny9FY4FKkJCLWkTSnlAyLS6E4Hh wRKMtf5UDVq4QhUozQI+hGSWWJadH0ys15XRQPMdMVVELfPE/G7VXCRQj5c29+zRzh0J XlZw==
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-Received: by 10.66.163.2 with SMTP id ye2mr715371pab.170.1382793926133; Sat, 26 Oct 2013 06:25:26 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To: <374dc0e1-a464-4c5e-a7c5-369db22c0800@googlegroups.com>
References: <6f2b7$525f2302$5419b3e4$13466@cache1.tilbu1.nb.home.nl> <13f400f3-7f64-45e3-8483-160fd1f28158@googlegroups.com> <mailman.1542.1382731552.18130.python-list@python.org> <cdfd7c4b-f562-45a4-856b-7613953ed6b4@googlegroups.com> <526b2b90$0$29972$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <374dc0e1-a464-4c5e-a7c5-369db22c0800@googlegroups.com>
Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2013 00:25:26 +1100
Subject: Re: Don't use default Google Group client (was re:....)
From: Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com>
To: python-list@python.org
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
X-Mailman-Approved-At: Sat, 26 Oct 2013 21:16:48 +0200
X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15
Precedence: list
List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language <python-list.python.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-list>, <mailto:python-list-request@python.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-list/>
List-Post: <mailto:python-list@python.org>
List-Help: <mailto:python-list-request@python.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list>, <mailto:python-list-request@python.org?subject=subscribe>
Newsgroups: comp.lang.python
Message-ID: <mailman.1595.1382815010.18130.python-list@python.org>
Lines: 28
NNTP-Posting-Host: 2001:888:2000:d::a6
X-Trace: 1382815010 news.xs4all.nl 15867 [2001:888:2000:d::a6]:55850
X-Complaints-To: abuse@xs4all.nl
Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.python:57649

On Sat, Oct 26, 2013 at 11:15 PM, rusi <rustompmody@gmail.com> wrote:
> tl;dr I think Mark's scoldings in this regard will work if they come not just from him but from any and every one.  They are likely to have a larger subscription if you would agree to change: "Dont use GG!!"
> to
> "Users of GG are requested to read and follow these instructions
> https://wiki.python.org/moin/GoogleGroupsPython "

I would say that "Don't use Google Groups" is absolutely the right
advice, because it penalizes the ultimate cause of the problem. If a
bus company sets timetables that demand the drivers work the
accelerator and brake in binary (one or the other is always flat
down), the advice is not "Don't buy eggs" but "Don't ride that bus
line". Considering how easy it is to use some other way of posting and
reading, there's no reason for the makers of a fundamentally flawed
piece of software to be rewarded with usage.

Anyway, no matter how carefully you fix your own posts, you'll still
run into the one problem you can't fix: that, because of the extremely
poor signal-to-noise ratio from GG, a number of people just won't see
your post.

And trust me. No matter how many times you ask people to read that
wiki page, you'll still get far FAR better results by recommending
Thunderbird or email. I've seen a good number of people go "Oh, my
posts are annoying because of the software I'm using? No probs, I'll
change software to not be annoying", which solves the problem without
the fiddlinesses that the wiki page advocates.

ChrisA