Path: csiph.com!x330-a1.tempe.blueboxinc.net!usenet.pasdenom.info!weretis.net!feeder1.news.weretis.net!feeder.erje.net!newsfeed.xs4all.nl!newsfeed6.news.xs4all.nl!xs4all!post.news.xs4all.nl!not-for-mail Return-Path: X-Original-To: python-list@python.org Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org X-Spam-Status: OK 0.014 X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 0.97; '*S*': 0.00; 'skip': 0.04; 'ignored': 0.07; 'rules.': 0.07; 'python': 0.08; 'assembler': 0.09; 'lawrence': 0.09; 'readable': 0.09; '25,': 0.12; 'am,': 0.12; 'developer': 0.12; 'language,': 0.14; '(do': 0.16; 'common.': 0.16; 'fancy': 0.16; 'levels).': 0.16; 'mixture': 0.16; 'opinions.': 0.16; 'received:192.168.1.104': 0.16; 'cc:addr :python-list': 0.16; 'wrote:': 0.18; 'written': 0.19; 'cc:no real name:2**0': 0.21; 'wrote': 0.21; 'file,': 0.21; 'header:In-Reply- To:1': 0.22; 'feb': 0.22; 'changed': 0.23; 'pep': 0.23; 'sat,': 0.25; 'structure': 0.26; 'cc:2**0': 0.26; 'code': 0.26; 'code,': 0.28; 'separate': 0.28; '(this': 0.28; "i'm": 0.28; 'cc:addr:python.org': 0.29; 'pm,': 0.29; 'environment.': 0.30; 'key,': 0.30; 'chris': 0.30; 'nobody': 0.31; 'developers': 0.31; 'file.': 0.31; 'matching': 0.32; 'languages': 0.32; 'header:User- Agent:1': 0.33; 'instead': 0.33; 'file': 0.34; 'character': 0.34; 'however,': 0.35; 'something': 0.35; 'comment': 0.36; 'two': 0.36; 'acceptable': 0.37; 'consistently': 0.37; 'but': 0.37; "i'll": 0.38; 'received:192': 0.38; 'could': 0.38; 'some': 0.38; 'format': 0.38; 'received:192.168.1': 0.39; "i'd": 0.39; 'subject:Please': 0.40; 'more': 0.61; 'worth': 0.61; 'course,': 0.62; 'our': 0.63; 'ever': 0.64; 'high': 0.66; 'show': 0.66; 'special': 0.66; 'cause': 0.67; 'header:Reply-To:1': 0.70; 'reply-to:no real name:2**0': 0.72; 'spaces': 0.73; '11:49': 0.84; 'crude': 0.84; 'pain': 0.84; 'spaces.': 0.84; 'violating': 0.84; 'dozen': 0.91; 'dozens': 0.91; 'subject:!!': 0.93 Date: Fri, 24 Feb 2012 21:36:41 -0500 From: Dave Angel User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux x86_64; en-US; rv:1.9.2.24) Gecko/20111109 Thunderbird/3.1.16 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Chris Angelico Subject: Re: Please verify!! References: <724ccbd6-30d1-41bd-bf38-2a5ce82953a1@x19g2000yqh.googlegroups.com> <4F46C124.2070102@davea.name> <87mx88tyvc.fsf@benfinney.id.au> <4f47808b$0$29989$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Provags-ID: V02:K0:FXJjWlYK0ZEDOO9TxkkBaHa3655f9pwb4pilS6bhn3z Omhp/K6mJjiNiEZ8GbX9S9UYeT+jf2EstbLCLIDoda+kuQK73Y sM8Cs8LKgjrz4lIB1NGRZA/d5dhODYVyZyP3nUHPC0il2TUkVr l8TkdN2BZJR77+xYTWlgNefZydMfTKE5mZrpLCRX5YjmiMF6HO QohHGFbboTQ3mt29eztHY5rW5QFK4okvVxjaDK7A2J1/xAAGsW c/lA17GPajw0XTz1S6D7sRJKBg6u1zY/eittFX5MD9QcJK1j7r fCE6lZIWQFfKWl4jP9be4cCWTnXnVJHk9E6sf2+lRw/xGiCtA= = Cc: python-list@python.org X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list Reply-To: d@davea.name List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Newsgroups: comp.lang.python Message-ID: Lines: 42 NNTP-Posting-Host: 2001:888:2000:d::a6 X-Trace: 1330137442 news.xs4all.nl 6886 [2001:888:2000:d::a6]:60683 X-Complaints-To: abuse@xs4all.nl Xref: x330-a1.tempe.blueboxinc.net comp.lang.python:20851 On 02/24/2012 08:25 PM, Chris Angelico wrote: > On Sat, Feb 25, 2012 at 11:49 AM, Mark Lawrence wrote: >> Oo, thou sinner, fancy violating PEP 8 and standardising on tabs. > PEP 8 applies only to Python code, our standard is across all our > languages :) But yes, I'm a horrible sinner and I like tabs. They > separate the display (do you want tabs to show as four-space indent, > two-centimeter indent, or fifty-pixel indent?) from the structure > (this line is indented two levels). Spaces merge those. > > ChrisA If tabs were ever implemented consistently and reasonably in both an editor and a matching language, then I'd consider leaving tabs in the file. But to me, they're just a crude way to compress the file, and the space they save is no longer worth the pain they cause (I came to this conclusion 30 years ago, and have re-evaluated it dozens of times as new editors and new languages changed the rules. At that time, I had one of my developers write an editor (shipped with our MSDOS system, instead of Edlin) that implemented it.) Some time when i have a lot more time, I'll state one of (many possible) the ways that tabs could be made acceptable in a limited environment. Almost 40 years ago, I wrote an editor and assembler whose file format used a separation character between fields. I used A0 because our screens at the time ignored the high bit, so a file was sort-of readable right out of the box. And the way that the developer jumped between fields was the semi-colon key, of course, since that's the position of the skip key in the keypunch we were replacing. However, I don't intend to foist my opinions on others, just to state them as opinions. At the office, we use special comment fields at end-of-file to tell Emacs how to deal with a mixture of tabs and spaces. Code written by a dozen people over a dozen years, and nobody wanted to enforce a conversion to something common. -- DaveA