Path: csiph.com!usenet.pasdenom.info!news.redatomik.org!newsfeed.xs4all.nl!newsfeed7.news.xs4all.nl!post.news.xs4all.nl!not-for-mail Return-Path: X-Original-To: python-list@python.org Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org X-Spam-Status: OK 0.088 X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 0.84; '*S*': 0.02; 'subject:Python': 0.05; 'received:openend.se': 0.09; 'received:theraft.openend.se': 0.09; 'cc:addr:python-list': 0.10; 'cc:addr:lac': 0.16; 'cc:addr:openend.se': 0.16; 'from:addr:lac': 0.16; 'from:addr:openend.se': 0.16; 'from:name:laura creighton': 0.16; 'message-id:@fido.openend.se': 0.16; 'received:89.233': 0.16; 'received:89.233.217': 0.16; 'received:89.233.217.133': 0.16; 'received:fido': 0.16; 'received:fido.openend.se': 0.16; 'task.': 0.16; 'laura': 0.18; 'cc:addr:python.org': 0.21; 'cc:2**1': 0.22; 'cc:no real name:2**0': 0.23; '2015': 0.23; 'sat,': 0.23; 'header :In-Reply-To:1': 0.24; 'chris': 0.26; "doesn't": 0.28; 'went': 0.28; 'about.': 0.29; 'lot.': 0.29; 'received:se': 0.29; 'relative': 0.31; 'task': 0.31; 'getting': 0.33; 'point': 0.33; 'being': 0.36; 'basic': 0.36; 'subject:: ': 0.37; 'charset:us- ascii': 0.37; 'world,': 0.38; 'wanted': 0.39; 'some': 0.40; 'learn': 0.60; 'even': 0.61; 'bottom': 0.61; 'real': 0.61; 'header :Message-Id:1': 0.62; 'improved': 0.63; 'subject:Data': 0.66; 'talking': 0.67; 'score': 0.76; 'skill': 0.76; 'paper': 0.78; 'received:89': 0.80; '+1000,': 0.84; 'proving': 0.84; 'studying': 0.84; 'performers': 0.91; 'improvement': 0.93; 'poorly': 0.93; 'students,': 0.97; 'taught': 0.97 To: Chris Angelico cc: "python-list@python.org" , lac@openend.se From: Laura Creighton Subject: Re: Pure Python Data Mangling or Encrypting In-Reply-To: Message from Chris Angelico of "Sat, 27 Jun 2015 20:16:47 +1000." References: <558b7e85$0$1648$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <558bc912$0$2899$c3e8da3$76491128@news.astraweb.com> <558c1a7e$0$1668$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <558d86b0$0$1659$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <558e1ac6$0$1675$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <558e610f$0$1648$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <28371.1435408057.1@fido> Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2015 14:27:38 +0200 X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.3.9 (theraft.openend.se [89.233.217.130]); Sat, 27 Jun 2015 14:27:40 +0200 (CEST) X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20+ Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Newsgroups: comp.lang.python Message-ID: Lines: 29 NNTP-Posting-Host: 2001:888:2000:d::a6 X-Trace: 1435408071 news.xs4all.nl 2902 [2001:888:2000:d::a6]:37194 X-Complaints-To: abuse@xs4all.nl Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.python:93245 In a message of Sat, 27 Jun 2015 20:16:47 +1000, Chris Angelico writes: >Okay, Johannes, NOW you're proving that you don't have a clue what >you're talking about. D-K effect doesn't go away... > >ChrisA You need to read the paper again. That was the whole point -- when Kruger and Dunning went and taught the people at the bottom quadrile some basic skill in the task being estimated, and taught people at the top quadrile how poorly their peers were performing, their ability to estimate how they would score relative to their peers improved a whole lot. But, of course, since these were academics studying students, they had access to bottom-quadrile performers who actually wanted to learn and improve. In the real world, it is getting the bottom-performers to even notice that they need improvement that may be the most difficult task. Laura