Path: csiph.com!v102.xanadu-bbs.net!xanadu-bbs.net!feeder.erje.net!eu.feeder.erje.net!newsfeed.freenet.ag!news2.euro.net!newsgate.cistron.nl!newsgate.news.xs4all.nl!post.news.xs4all.nl!not-for-mail Return-Path: X-Original-To: python-list@python.org Delivered-To: python-list@mail.python.org X-Spam-Status: OK 0.037 X-Spam-Evidence: '*H*': 0.93; '*S*': 0.00; 'programmer': 0.03; 'startup': 0.05; 'subject:Python': 0.06; 'c++,': 0.07; 'javascript,': 0.07; 'perl,': 0.07; 'php,': 0.09; 'subject:Why': 0.09; 'cc:addr:python-list': 0.11; 'python': 0.11; "wouldn't": 0.14; '(sorry,': 0.16; 'bash,': 0.16; 'it),': 0.16; 'massively': 0.16; 'programmer,': 0.16; 'subject:make': 0.16; 'you"': 0.16; 'language': 0.16; 'wrote:': 0.18; 'not,': 0.20; 'email addr:gmail.com>': 0.22; 'cc:addr:python.org': 0.22; 'replace': 0.24; 'mon,': 0.24; 'cc:2**0': 0.24; 'cc:no real name:2**0': 0.24; '>': 0.26; 'appreciated': 0.26; 'header:In-Reply-To:1': 0.27; 'raise': 0.29; 'message-id:@mail.gmail.com': 0.30; "i'm": 0.30; 'url:mailman': 0.30; 'asked': 0.31; 'went': 0.31; 'too.': 0.31; 'probably': 0.32; 'quite': 0.32; 'url:python': 0.33; 'knows': 0.35; 'something': 0.35; 'but': 0.35; 'received:google.com': 0.35; 'google': 0.35; 'c++': 0.36; 'doubt': 0.36; 'himself': 0.36; 'ibm': 0.36; 'joined': 0.36; 'done': 0.36; 'url:listinfo': 0.36; 'url:org': 0.36; 'should': 0.36; 'employee': 0.37; 'being': 0.38; 'depends': 0.38; 'whatever': 0.38; 'pm,': 0.38; 'little': 0.38; 'sure': 0.39; 'enough': 0.39; 'url:mail': 0.40; 'easy': 0.60; 'company': 0.60; 'lower': 0.61; 'year.': 0.61; 'back': 0.62; 'making': 0.63; 'day.': 0.63; 'happen': 0.63; 'subject:more': 0.64; 'more': 0.64; 'to:addr:gmail.com': 0.65; 'internet': 0.71; 'hey,': 0.75; 'day': 0.76; 'low': 0.83; 'december,': 0.84; 'end.': 0.84; 'idiot': 0.84; 'portugal.': 0.84; 'subject:money': 0.84; '"how': 0.91; 'speaks': 0.91; 'why?': 0.91; 'average': 0.93; '2013': 0.98 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:x-received:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id :subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=skUO6gjA3Xn/JvNQqaffh63MpH9/WmL0UXgrZOMeeJQ=; b=NS3mGfYTB2WB8gZ9qVbQyEkTPoUPc/348TVe/h49b3JFL1QAwkGsCtBWp5Yf26MDE2 6UsxD2L4Ym7D+/bRebN8lRB3jK/VC5svmas1HTboISkjmOwbOT2bXrhCS4yKJMozJWT+ SrMHPbZUruv3Q1fLEo9+t1CjnVLuoup3qjHgHBlmtaSskN3lyt8SzI6F6imE2nr6Scb3 Jh/mr1klF8f4xE63PwfLb63oE/GlzBsAfx6iBCQBieas1K4KqfOiFPf2fOBmlTSFuDTo 8hPpcgll6gzdKQxFjU1YJcrlHC/F/Z1eD3ejGoR4zgwmA8xAbMGBIeOScbhyz4XV/xY4 kMXQ== MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.49.25.112 with SMTP id b16mr26197834qeg.21.1367830854718; Mon, 06 May 2013 02:00:54 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <5186aeb6$0$29997$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> Date: Mon, 6 May 2013 10:00:54 +0100 Subject: Re: Why do Perl programmers make more money than Python programmers From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?F=E1bio_Santos?= To: Chris Angelico Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=047d7b6da4c836378f04dc08f097 Cc: python-list@python.org X-BeenThere: python-list@python.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion list for the Python programming language List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Newsgroups: comp.lang.python Message-ID: Lines: 101 NNTP-Posting-Host: 2001:888:2000:d::a6 X-Trace: 1367830862 news.xs4all.nl 15883 [2001:888:2000:d::a6]:34929 X-Complaints-To: abuse@xs4all.nl Xref: csiph.com comp.lang.python:44811 --047d7b6da4c836378f04dc08f097 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable All good points. I should probably blame the smallness of my company aswell= . On 6 May 2013 09:11, "Chris Angelico" wrote: > On Mon, May 6, 2013 at 5:49 PM, F=E1bio Santos > wrote: > > I may rise the average pay of a Python programmer in Portugal. I have > asked > > for a raise back in December, and was told that it wouldn't happen befo= re > > this year. I have done well. I think I deserve better pay than a > supermarket > > employee now. I am sure that my efforts were appreciated and I will be > > rewarded. I am being sarcastic. > > > > The above paragraph wouldn't be true if I programmed in perl, c++ or > lisp. > > I dunno, it depends more on where you work than what you work with. > I'm the top employee at my workplace and use C++, Pike, PHP, > Javascript, and bash, plus ancillaries like SQL... and my salary is > definitely on the low end. Why? Because I work for a startup. No doubt > Google or IBM would pay their top people way more than I'm getting, > but that's not something a little internet startup can afford. So I > bide my time :) Some day we'll be massively profitable... some day. > And if not, hey, I'm making enough to survive. > > Of course, there's the whole thing of "how easy would it be to replace > you" too. If the only language you know is PHP, chances are you can be > replaced by any idiot straight out of secondary skool (sorry, that's > school_real_secondary now isn't it), but someone who speaks FORTRAN > and knows the bank's internal systems well enough to maintain them can > ask for whatever salary he likes and still be cheaper than finding a > replacement. But that expert FORTRAN programmer, if he quit his job > and went searching, would quite probably find himself at the lower end > again if he joined a small company. > > ChrisA > -- > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list > --047d7b6da4c836378f04dc08f097 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

All good points. I should probably blame the smallness of my= company aswell.

On 6 May 2013 09:11, "Chris Angelico" = <rosuav@gmail.com> wrote:
On Mon, May 6, 2013 at 5:49 PM, F=E1bio Santos <fabiosantosart@gmail.com> wrote:
> I may rise the average pay of a Python programmer in Portugal. I have = asked
> for a raise back in December, and was told that it wouldn't happen= before
> this year. I have done well. I think I deserve better pay than a super= market
> employee now. I am sure that my efforts were appreciated and I will be=
> rewarded. I am being sarcastic.
>
> The above paragraph wouldn't be true if I programmed in perl, c++ = or lisp.

I dunno, it depends more on where you work than what you work with.
I'm the top employee at my workplace and use C++, Pike, PHP,
Javascript, and bash, plus ancillaries like SQL... and my salary is
definitely on the low end. Why? Because I work for a startup. No doubt
Google or IBM would pay their top people way more than I'm getting,
but that's not something a little internet startup can afford. So I
bide my time :) Some day we'll be massively profitable... some day.
And if not, hey, I'm making enough to survive.

Of course, there's the whole thing of "how easy would it be to rep= lace
you" too. If the only language you know is PHP, chances are you can be=
replaced by any idiot straight out of secondary skool (sorry, that's school_real_secondary now isn't it), but someone who speaks FORTRAN
and knows the bank's internal systems well enough to maintain them can<= br> ask for whatever salary he likes and still be cheaper than finding a
replacement. But that expert FORTRAN programmer, if he quit his job
and went searching, would quite probably find himself at the lower end
again if he joined a small company.

ChrisA
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